PDD-24-0090

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1. 1Jan 9, 2024
   Board of County CommissionersP58Public hearingAdopted

   Approved minutes

   Approved to adopt by a roll call vote with Commissioner Bradford absent from the vote.

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   Starkey

   42:59Fifty eight.

   OakleyChair

   43:00Fifty eight. P

   Starkey

   43:01fifty eight was advertised in the Tampa Bay Times November first, twenty twenty three.

   Denise

   43:08Good afternoon, Commissioner. Denise Hernandez Planning and Development. Item P fifty-eight, this is the adoption hearing for this item. It's a land development code amendment. Um we were hoping this would be Amendment 67, but it's actually Amendment 66. Um so the Board of County Commissioners directed staff to make some changes to section 905.2, which is landscaping buffering. What we did is um the board wanted staff to add um to give applicants the ability to be able to use the current

   43:38um code provisions in the landscape ordinance instead of having to pool old landscape files that had been approved um in the past. So uh that we added that in the into the applicability section. I'm going to read the I the ordinance title and ask that you please accept public comment and adopt by roll call vote. So it's PDD 240090, an ordinance by the Pasco County Board of County Commissioners, amending the Pasco County Land Development

   44:08Code, Chapter 100, General Provision, Section 108.112 Enforcement, Chapter 300 Procedure, Section 305, Neighborhood Meeting. Chapter 400 Permit Types and Applications, Section 403.7, Mass Grading, Section 403.10 Landscape Plan, Section 407.2 Variances, Section 407.5, Alternative Standards, Chapter 500, Zoning, Section 522, Master Plan Unit Development District, Chapter 600, Overly and Special Districts, Section 604, Northeast Rural Protection Overlay District, Chapter 800, Natural and Cultural Resource Protection,

   44:39Section 805 Director Director Direction Wetlands, Chapter 900, Development Standards, Section 901.2, Transportation Corridor Management, Section 901.6, Street Design and Dedication, Section 904, Fire Protection, Section 907, On Street On-Site Parking, Loading and Stacking and Lighting Standards, Chapter 1000, Miscellaneous Structure Regulations, Section 1002, Wireless Wireless Communications Facilities, Section 1003, Gates, Fences and Walls, Chapter 30. 1300 concurrency and impact fee, Section 1302.2, mobility fees, Section 1302.3,

   45:10school impact fee, section 1302.4, parks and recreation impact fee, section 1302.5, Library Impact Fees, Section 1302.6, Fire Combat and Rescue Service Impact Fees, and other sections as necessary for internal consistency, providing for applicability, providing for repealer, providing for severability, inclusion into land development. code and an effective date. Again if you would please take public comment and adopt by roll call phone.

   Mariano

   45:35Mr. Chairman Mariano I'd like to go go to section three oh five one on neighborhood meetings. Um I've talked about this before, but as far as the neighborhood meeting goes, um Yeah, we had I'll say just this the Saddlebrook hearings where we had a series of meetings with different groups all the way around. And when you've got an MPUD like that, I should think it should we should dictate that it be one meeting that everybody can attend. Or if you want to have a series of meetings, at least one meeting that everybody can attend right up front. The

   46:07the Lynx Golf course going through the same type of thing. We had separate meetings so nobody knows what everybody else is thinking. No discussions are done in full. It it kind of divides and confuses everybody to what's gonna go on. So I would like to see something done better than that. Um and when I see the change is going to be the application is going to be then As far as like st starting the book needing meeting accepted for review. If you keep it at accepted for review, it's early in the earlier in

   46:37the process, it gives the neighborhood media a chance to look at it and then reactions can happen, changes can be made up up front. If you wait till it's deemed complete for content If it's I don't think we need to wait to that line. As soon as they're going to submit something, I think that's when a neighborhood meeting should happen and go from there. And at some point, if it's an M PUD, not just a regular development, but if it's an M PUD like that, I think someone from staff should be there to actually listen to what the residents have to say as well, so they can incorporate those things in. To

   47:07their to their input.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   47:11Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mr. Chairman M let me play devil's advocate with the commissioner. Um however if you don't wait until it's deemed complete for content it may not be a it may not be something that move moves forward. I mean it may not be Baked, basically. Um so Deem Complete for content is just when we start

   47:41or step planning staff starts review. It's not way into the process, it's within the first

   Denise

   47:50Yes. Correct. With within the first less than thirty days. Yeah.

   Mariano

   47:56Yeah. So Maybe within thirty days of the submittal then. So so And then you get thirty days from because right now the way it's done it's gonna be th the the the thirty days before the public hearing's gonna happen. That's the only time it has to happen.

   Denise

   48:14The code does require that the meeting be held a minimum of thirty days prior to the public hearing and that a minimum of twenty-five days prior to the public hearing that the neighborhood meeting summary package be submitted to staff. The code also says that the applicant is to at to have at least one meeting is required, but they can have other meetings as well. So the reason for this particular code change um com complete for content is because there was an application for conditional use that came in. that

   48:44the applicant submitted the application, it was accepted in Acela but not accepted for comment content. Ex the Acela system accepted the application. The person set up the neighborhood meeting and when the application when the actual application all the comments were received The request was completely different. It was for a a completely different height of a tower. It was a p completely different type of tower. So the person just went ahead and had their neighborhood meeting without it being accepted for com for content.

   Mariano

   49:14Right. Well that's that's that's a good point. Um I don't mind that s but for for those reasons, okay, I'll be alright with that. But I do want to see it that especially on an MPUD though, I don't want divided on meetings. If I got if I got a group of people all affected, I want them all to see it in one shot, not broken up to one little group here, one little group here, one little group

   OakleyChair

   49:33there.

   Mariano

   49:33I need to get everybody looked at it.

   OakleyChair

   49:34Brad, do you have something you can add?

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   49:36Uh yeah, I just wanted to brand tip and plague development, just wanted to add that there's uh there's a couple of elements involved in that and and I understand exactly why you'd like to have that in there as early as possible. It's very important to get that community involvement as early as we can. Uh our our only main issue here is um that uh what's originally submitted to us is almost never the end product. So if that meeting is done too soon then the community is not

   Mariano

   50:03I'm okay with that fact. Okay. I'm okay with that change.

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   50:05Okay. Um the other issue is that with a project like Saddlebook, uh you could have a a very large group of people, several hundred people. We don't have a lot of facilities given the the criteria to meet, we would have to figure out exactly how to do the logistics of that because there's certain times of day that these meetings need to happen, certain days of the week it can be difficult. We would probably want to include some sort of a hybrid option to do some virtual, some in person, something like that to be able to accommodate a what could possibly be an extremely large crowd like that.

   Mariano

   50:34If we had to go to a school fine, but as far as the Saddleback argument, that place could have held it all. So I don't I really don't want to go into that argument with it. But I think if you're gonna have an effect A MPUD that's already been existing, and it could be that that'll the uh Baker Woods East, you've got something that's been entitled there for many, many years, people bought into certainties, you're gonna make any changes to any part of the MPD, everybody should see it, at the same time to comment on it. When it's complete. But at least have that notice where they can look at it. And then if they need to make changes they can go do that or encounter that

   51:04in, but at least We can go. And if it's that big as an MPUD, then I think a staff person should be there at that neighborhood meeting so they can actually take the feedback back to their back to our own staff to say, here's what I heard, here's what they said, do we want to make any changes?

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   51:18So we have actually uh we took your advice uh at the prior hearing and we actually have already incorporated that into our notice to ask people to provide us with that feedback, provide us some minutes from the meeting any questions or concerns. Directly to us uh instead of just turning them in at that meeting to make sure that we actually get all that that feedback.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   51:36Commissioner Yeah.

   51:40It this may be I don't it it sounds like both both the examples that I'm hearing is You want a neighborhood meeting that includes everyone in an existing M PUD. Yes. And that's a different that's a That's a finite subset of New MPUDs that are coming in. So so we could add something to this that said for existing projects, the

   52:10neighborhood meetings shall accommodate All of the all of the neighborhood associations with that exist within that M P U D. That's my

   Mariano

   52:20desire. Thank you.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   52:21Uh

   OakleyChair

   52:22huh.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   52:27Does that Staff okay? W I mean did I

   52:33I mean I could be it could be a gr it could be a large number of people, but I think that it's a it's a rarer occasion than than what you normally deal with.

   Starkey

   52:46Um, Mr. Chairman Mariano.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   52:48Yes.

   Starkey

   52:49I have a question on the mask, maybe. So, um, and I have a photo. And I sent this picture to the administrator and one of our land use attorneys this week. And I was talking to some folks in the development industry in the last few days. Um this is about Kogan grasp, which is on my commissioner items uh for discussion. So just waiting for it to come. Come up. This is uh Longleaf Neighborhood Four. And um And

   53:20I'm I'm concerned when we go to clear property But it has coton grass on it. It then uh gets transported somewhere. It's on the it's on the machinery. and it gets brought into someone else's property. That's how it was brought into my neighborhood of Aristida. Um unfortunately when it started growing up behind someone's house and the burn that they put in They wouldn't let the HOA go in and spray it and now it's all

   53:50through my neighborhood. Um Kogan grass is one of the world's most invasive grasses. And we want you know you know how they let the Python thing get get away from 'em in the Everglades and the Malauca? Um We don't want our county to get inundated with Cogan grass. We don't. So You know, I've asked the NAS to have a policy about development in Cogan grass. Um At the very least we need to

   54:21be identifying if Cogan grass is on a and on property before they start clearing it. What's the plan? So that we don't spread it to someone else's property. And so this is this is the this is the Cogan grass along Starkey Boulevard in Longleaf Neighborhood 4. Um, can you go to the next page? and they they're starting to scrape this whole corner away and it's solid coging grass on that corner, which I had alerted uh the Longleaf

   54:51neighborhood Um to the C D D board to please do something about this, but This is in neighborhood four, not something that they were they were in charge of and I think it got cleared before anyone did anything, so There really needs to be a policy. on how we protect ourselves. From this. And is is the mass grading place where that would occur? And

   Mike Carballa

   55:21Yes, that's being worked on with with the executive team. We've talked about it. Um and then public works also has an eradication plan, but that's post post.

   55:32Well I I I agree with you, but but yes, we're working on that. Brad, I don't know if you've got something else to add.

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   55:37Uh no, I'm just gonna say yes, that we're working with public works and also Keith Wiley's team uh natural resources and uh we actually have started putting language in conditions of approval on projects that are gonna be going to construction that you know for those invasive species if they're gonna have to use the proper process to get rid of them.

   Starkey

   55:56Okay, well I'd like to add it now to say you have to identify if there is COVID. Grass. Uh

   OakleyChair

   56:03prior to the

   Starkey

   56:04venture on your property and and confer with someone on how you're gonna properly deal with that. Before It gets to every neighborhood. So so that

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   56:13language is actually already exists for invasive species in general. So

   Starkey

   56:18what happened to call out

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   56:19code and graphs.

   Starkey

   56:26What department handles that?

   Unidentified speakerVoice C

   56:30Handles invasive species on a on property. So so as of the discussion

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   56:37just a short time ago, uh we would look at that as part of the site plan review and condition it uh and it would be followed through with the uh natural resources team. Um they would work with natural resources as to how to and public works as to how actually destroyed. Okay, so I'm asking. I mean that that

   Unidentified speakerVoice C

   56:56probably wasn't in place at the time these were well this just this just star th long leaf just came through this in the last six months. Yes, this was it was only a few months ago that we

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   57:07uh started having that discussion working on codegrass. So that that's a much newer policy that we have in place

   OakleyChair

   57:12on. Okay. So if if if that been in view when they first started, that's when this has got to be taken care of when they first started developing.

   Unidentified speakerVoice B

   57:21Yeah, we we alert them to it and we've we've uh tried to make an effort of of having our natural resources team as part of pre-application meetings and and site reviews actually common in in that regard. Um they're trying to make trips out to sea. They've made some changes in how they're they're actually going out and looking at some of the weather delineations and they're seeing physically being at the property and seeing some of that. So hopefully uh you know this is gonna be something that we can deal with a little bit more easily in the future.

   OakleyChair

   57:48Right. But I think that's something that we need to really take hold of 'cause If you if you don't make it a big point to get rid of it. then it will never be gotten rid of and it'll be spread all over the county. So that's that's the idea of attacking when a new development starting list make sure they're getting rid of the right way. Let that be part of the process. So

   Mike Carballa

   58:09we can do it very early on. Yeah, and like and like any process it it takes a little bit of time before you see that come out of the ground for things that have other received other you know, and then we have the reactive portion through public works and natural resources to deal with it while it's on the ground and you know that

   OakleyChair

   58:24Okay. Mr

   Weightman

   58:24Wayton

   Mike Carballa

   58:25I hear you.

   Weightman

   58:26I'd be remiss if that remind the staff and everybody involved in this that it's been a solid year when Commissioner Starkey and I brought this up very early on last year. It's been more

   Starkey

   58:39than a year.

   Weightman

   58:40Yeah, and she's brought it up prior to me joining the board. So for you know, twelve months to go by on something that's a real problem when I think this board collectively over a year ago said, hey, let's get disciplined and address this problem is a bit unacceptable to me in the timeline.

   Mike Carballa

   59:01I think we've been very disciplined in in moving ahead of a lot of advances that the board has asked over the past year as well, to include Kogan Crass. And to include a number of other things in the development arena. And again, we we continue to make advances on the development services front with how we handle and manage development in the county. So I appreciate it. I certainly share the impatience for wanting to push a lot of things forward, but we're not the the team is not sitting on their hands. We are moving and advancing

   59:31the board's directives. It just it just takes a little time. So we do appreciate the board's patience as we as we move and and try to take care of these items to to include Cogan grass. It is not lost on us. But I I understand your impatience, sir, and and we will continue to advance that as well as a number of other initiatives that the board's asking for.

   Starkey

   59:49So on the drive here on fifty two, which is All the new development of I shouldn't say all. Never say all. A lot of the new grading of State Road fifty two has Coconcrass in it. But it blew my mind when I passed an island. And I d I didn't I took a picture of it but I don't remember where it was, if it was but it's on the new part. The island is brand new. Um and the island the grass coming up is Coking

   1:00:19grass in a little island in the middle of fifty two. They so they put the fill in there from somewhere and brought the Cocongras in. What what I was told was it um is on the the uh scrapers and that they look they may have to wash those down in some way and I maybe we provide a place somewhere where they can go. and get washed down if they have worked on a piece of land that has cognass on it. But if that's one of the way it's getting spread is from the

   1:00:50equipment.

   OakleyChair

   1:00:51Okay.

   Starkey

   1:00:53Okay.

   OakleyChair

   1:00:53All right. Is there um anyone to speak to this item? Anyone speak to us?

   Starkey

   1:00:57There is no one signed up.

   OakleyChair

   1:00:58No one signed up.

   Starkey

   1:00:59I I have a question for Denise. Barbara's got more items

   OakleyChair

   1:01:02to cover.

   Starkey

   1:01:03Yeah, no, I'm sorry, I'll be quick. Did we did all the we had a meeting yesterday on and did all the things we talked about with code and staff do we need to tweak anything that we from our discussions yesterday? We do not. Okay. I didn't I looked at my notes and I didn't write anything.

   OakleyChair

   1:01:20Oh I won't recognize Barbara Wilhelm. Barbara

   Barbara Wilhite

   1:01:22Will High, [address removed]. I understand the conversation about the neighborhood meetings. I'm not really clear what you're gonna write um because we need to get a trigger first as to when we have to do a mandatory neighborhood meeting in an MPUD, like we're changing an amenity, decreasing open space, modifying a golf course. Maybe we get a list of stuff that's a mandatory trigger and then um have a a mandatory requirement that everybody get noticed for one meeting. 'Cause I think you're adopting

   1:01:52here, right? So I can't get to comment on whatever is written pursuant to your direction. So but right now we don't have a mandatory requirement for m every MPUD that's amended that we do a neighborhood meeting. I certainly don't want to see that happen because we do lots of changes where we just change a lot standard, you know, a setback and those types of things. We don't want to have to go to a meeting with the whole neighborhood of Trinity to do that. So that's my thought is we we just need to sit down and identify the triggers for a mandatory meeting and how we have to conduct it so that the commissioner's um

   1:02:22concerns addressed. Does that sound reasonable?

   Mariano

   1:02:26Maybe if the conditions if the s substantial deviation.

   Barbara Wilhite

   1:02:30Well that's a whole bunch of 'em. When we do we do modifications every day to to MPUDs. We modify I just modified Northwood twice, Northwood MP twice for very minor things, substantial amendments. And we would have had to notify the whole neighborhood over something that nobody would care about. Nobody did care about it 'cause we noticed people and they didn't care, so

   Mariano

   1:02:48Well, that's a some I guess sometimes we're gonna And maybe we need to

   Barbara Wilhite

   1:02:52Well I'd ask for this matter then so we can get this right. Well I this is actually really important. I mean you can't you know

   Unidentified speakerVoice D

   1:03:00sure.

   Denise

   1:03:02There are a lot of live local related items within this adoption, so we do not want a continuance. Um we could take direction to work on a code amendment to make modifications to the neighborhood meeting section. That can come as either a standalone Or I always have a ton of things that I need I've I've already started on new modifications that need to be done to the land development code.

   Mariano

   1:03:24Right and right now I think you're working also on as Terry and I talked the signage as well. So maybe when you get the signage ready you can bring that back as well.

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   1:03:33Signage.

   Denise

   1:03:43Yes, it's something we're working on. And the R V thing we're working on as well. So yeah. So I've got a lot of things I'm working on. So I just don't want to I don't want to derail this one, please. I know. I

   Mariano

   1:03:53I

   1:03:53think that's a good thing.

   1:03:54I just don't want to get a situation again where I've got situation where it It's not in the code, so you can't make us could do it. I don't want to hear that again. So I don't know how we get around that.

   Starkey

   1:04:06Okay, move approval. Second.

   OakleyChair

   1:04:09I have a motion second. Roll call vote.

   Mariano

   1:04:11Uh hang on. Does it include the changes we that Mr. Steinstein has made?

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   1:04:18That's up to you. Uh you've heard you heard Ms. Wilhite object to it. So I don't I've dealt with two neighborhoods that have

   Mariano

   1:04:27like been

   Unidentified speakerVoice A

   1:04:28burned by it. And I think you've heard that Denise saying that she's gonna bring it back in a subsequent amendment if that if that's acceptable to the board. But That's a that's a policy decision for you all. Alright, we'll

   Mariano

   1:04:42wait for it to come

   1:04:43back.

   OakleyChair

   1:04:44Okay. We'll wait. So Denise, you got that?

   Denise

   1:04:47I have it, yes.

   OakleyChair

   1:04:48Okay.

   Starkey

   1:04:48Thank you.

   OakleyChair

   1:04:50All right. All in favor of a roll call vote?

   Starkey

   1:04:52District two, Commissioner Weightman. Aye. District three, Commissioner Starkey. Aye. District four, Commissioner Bradford. District 5, Commissioner Mariano. Aye. District 1, Chairman Oakley.

   OakleyChair

   1:05:02Aye. Motion passed 4-0. Now, uh, Mr. Steinsteiner, if you