Zoning Amendment (Regular) – North Pasco RV Resort MPUD Master Planned Unit Development – VCare Consultants, LLC – A Rezoning Request from an A-C Agricultural Zoning District and an A-R Agricultural-Residential Zoning District to an MPUD Master Planned Unit Development District to Allow the Development of a 550-Space RV Resort and Associated Infrastructure and Amenities on Approximately 131.68 Acres
What the county recorded
Staff recommendation
Approval with Conditions
DispositionApproved
Approved Staff’s recommendation with Commissioner Fitzpatrick voting nay.
The source document
The county’s agenda for Board of County Commissioners, Apr 5, 2022
The published PDF, as served by the county. This item is one entry in it.
The county’s minutes for Board of County Commissioners, Apr 5, 2022
The published PDF, as served by the county. This item is one entry in it.
This case, across meetings
PDD-22-7422 in full →PDD-22-7422 was taken up 5 times between Dec 9, 2021 and Apr 5, 2022, continued 2 times — this is appearance 5.
What was said
Machine transcription of 55m of recording, with speaker names inferred from voice matching. 70% of 261 lines carry a name. It shows what was said, not what was decided, and both the words and the names can be wrong.
Aye. Okay, now we are on the rezoning. Where many many of these other things come into question. And with the applicant oh no, county.
Hold on, let me do publication.
Okay, publication.
Item P fifty-nine was published in the Tampe Times on November twenty-fourth, twenty twenty-one.
All right, good afternoon everybody. Tammy Snyder, Planning and Development Department. And I bring to you North Pasco R V Resort M P D, PD D twenty two seventy-four twenty-two.
And here we have the location map. It's directly in between and abutting Lake Iola Road and I-75. And proposed as a rezoning request from an AC Agricultural Zoning District and an AR Agricultural Residential Zoning District to an MPUD to allow the development of a 550-space RV resort and associated infrastructure and amenities on approximately 131.68 acres. Also requested is a variation from the LDC
section 805.6 restrictions on post-development wetlands and upland buffers within residential lots and non-residential parcels. To allow a recorded covenant over the entirety of the MPUD rather than an HOA C D D merchants or property owners association. And this covenant shall impose upon the developer a perpetual obligation to operate, maintain, repair, replace, insure, pay taxes with respect to all open space, drainage areas, common areas, landscaped areas, wetland areas, buffer areas,
preservation, conservation. areas, recreation areas, park areas, and other special purpose areas unless said areas are or is required to be dedicated to another governmental entity. And here's their master plan.
The project is located between Anabuding Lake Iola and I-75 and is in the North Monday area. On May 29, 2020, the applicant received approval for an alternative standard request to reduce the right-of-way dedication on Lake Iola from 67.5 to 57 feet per resolution 19-136. And the LBC specifies that variations from the code may be reviewed and approved by the PC and BCC during public hearing held on any application. for the MPUD
zoning amendments. Variations shall be allowed where the BCC specifically finds in the particular case that the proposed variation meter exceeds the intent of the code. And the PDD has reviewed the requested variation and found that it meets the intent of the code.
And conditions were added and revised since the last public hearing. And you also have a packet in front of you of some additional revisions since this slide was created subsequent to meetings with various commissioners. And you have the expertise in your packet as well. Condition number two was added to introduce Exhibit One, the Concept Site Plan, and designate authority to interpret and apply the Concept Site Plan to the PSP and construction plans. Condition number
11, which is now twelve, was modified to include any replacement or additional trees Shelby, comprised chiefly of Florida native drought tolerant plants. Condition number fourteen was added to require the construction of a six-foot shoulder along the project side of Lake Iola from just south of the project's entrance, north to Bayhead Road, consistent with the Northeast Pasco Multimodal Safety Action Plan final Report, dated March 2018. The ultimate details of the design and construction will be approved prior to or concurrent
with the construction plan approval. The applicant did reach out to the County Engineering Department for input regarding the proposed six thresholder prior to making the proposal and the County Engineering Department indicated that they had no issue. Condition number twenty-six was drafted to require pervious surfaces for the R R V pads that has since been revised. That particular one has been removed.
Wait, what happened? It's it's um that particular condition has been revised. It says the stormwater management facilities including ponds, swells, roadway, gutters, inlets, pipes and any other s Yes, any other storage for conveyance features will be designed in accordance with Pasco County and Swift MUD standards, assuming that RV pads, sidewalks, and vehicular use areas are impervious. So that is how twenty-six was revised after this slide was created. Condition
twenty-seven was included to address the proposed flash pad and its water use and recirculating. Condition twenty-eight requires that the on-site wastewater treatment is solely for the use of the RV resort and will meet all regulatory requirements. And Condition twenty-nine lists permitted uses, now twenty-nine A includes equestrian-oriented facilities. And this proposed request is consistent with the PASCO LDC, Chapter 400, Subsection 402.2, Zoning Amendment and PUD,
and with the applicable provisions of the Pasco County Comprehensive Plan. And I'm ready for any
question. I I do have a question. Um are you s so twenty six? Um are you saying that the pads can now be impervious when we were wanting them to be pervious? Which is concrete blocks versus a
concrete pad? Um con concrete blocks and that sort of stuff is not actually Hervious.
Tell that to your staff because they consider it in the permitting department pervious.
Okay.
Uh there's an inconsistency in our county then. Yeah because they
are what's this they are this is I know what's saying is that their stormwater system will account for those R V spaces, the R V pads.
Brad is coming to rescue you.
Yeah, because I can tell you I've dealt with that many times in Gulf Harbor's that they consider concrete block
Because I took out concrete block and put in a wood wood deck deck, which which they they considered per imper. They They considered my wood deck with half inch spacing Impervious. But concrete block was pervious.
Yes, for uh Brad Tipp in Planning and Development. Uh for intents and purposes we talk about two categories of pervious and impervious. But when it comes to pervious there are different quantifiers. You could be fifty percent impervious, seventy percent impervious, higher. Uh there's a coefficient that goes along with that. So there's some math that's done. Uh certain types of papers uh maybe done more tightly together are less pervious than other types of papers with open cuts in them, uh different
types of things like that are all taken into account. So there are different categories of that. And that's that's that taken into account with the calculations, the math that's done with the drainage.
Yeah, so that was not my experience, but maybe we can talk about that another time. Okay. Because I have personally had to experience this. Um
Alright, so Barbara, in my meeting with you and the applicant We talked about paper block.
What would you let Ms. Will Hyde unless you're you can speak? I think she needs to do her presentation. I was ready to go into my question.
Barbara Will Hight 6327 Grand Boulevard for the applicant. I have the whole receive and I have sworn. Yes. And I have the whole receive and file little thing to do here again. In the documents here are the PowerPoint that was presented and received and filed previously in the previous hearing, the transportation analysis, Francis Chan Marino's resume, the comp plan consistency analysis, and the zoning compliance. analysis. If you would be so kind as to receive and file those.
Motor receive and file.
Second.
All in favor? Aye. Aye.
And with that, as those received and filed, because I didn't say anything in my presentation that wasn't in this PowerPoint, I'm not going to go through that PowerPoint again. Um But if you have any specific questions, what we did try to do on the stormwater issue is have the most conservative stormwater design. And that's the way it's written which is we're gonna treat Because there's so much confusion whether things are pervious or impervious. We're just gonna treat everything as impervious, which max which is conservative and makes you have
more stormwater capacity. So that's what we wrote and and so We didn't have to get down into the confusion of what was pervious and impervious because there's a lot of confusion there. Um
With that I I would spend my time um we have Brian Nolan who can talk to you about the landscape plan. and what he did um and how it compares to other projects and what his instructions were and if he had any specific instructions or budgets or anything when he did that plan. So I'd like to him and come up and tell you a little bit about the plan he put together for this project.
Uh good afternoon Madam Chair, members of the board. Uh Brian Nolan of Lacido and Associates. Uh as Ms. Will Hight indicated uh And you've been sworn? Yes, I've been sworn. Thank you. Thank you. My firm was brought in uh as kind of a refresh or a reboot, if you will, on the plan. Uh so not only in the land planning aspect, but in the landscape architecture aspect. Uh we were directed by our client, the applicant, to put together a comprehensive uh landscape plan for the entire site, including
the buffer along uh Lake Iola, all of the internal uh plantings, the uh Plantings for the individual stalls. Uh we did that with really no direction or no budget. Um He may have a heart attack when it goes out to bid. Um but we were told to do what we would do in a high class, high upper scale uh uh development such as this. And the plant schedule that you see, all the renderings
that you see um that we generated with the help of Don Ferice uh reflects that direction. Um I mean there are hundreds Literally of trees that we're proposing of various sizes. Chiefly Florida native, some not to get some color. Typically Florida natives don't have a whole lot of color. But it is above and beyond what you would normally see for a normal run-of-the-mill, say KOA. We've
done KOAs, we've done several RV resorts. Uh in southeast Florida. Um And this is definitely above and beyond anything that you would typically uh see and and certainly above your code minimums as demonstrated in uh some of the calculations that we ran. And I'd be happy to address any questions that you have uh directly related to the The landscape plan.
I don't think we got those renderings. I have the old stuff, but I don't I don't know that I got anything new. Did anyone else?
Uh it's nothing new that we generate I think Ms. Well Hype.
But uh submitted all of that with uh the application.
Yeah we We took our master landscape plan and rendered it, 'cause our master landscape plan was black and white and we rendered that and that's the one that that staff has for the exhibit that's in the MPUD conditions.
The plan, the um That plan, but that's the same one before we ta did the four trees per I think that's the one that was the original one. Oops. I gotta go back. Maybe I was looking down.
Yeah.
And missed
it. So there's two different plans and they relate to each other. I'm not doing very well here at the PowerPoint. Um Hold on a second, let's see. There's two different plans that relate to each other. One is the overall master landscape plan, and then the then you have the RB space plan. There are two different plans. So you'd have to put 'em together. But the on the scale reason, for scale purposes we couldn't put it together.
Did you see it in there and I and I missed it?
Okay.
They're getting up to it. It's in the beginning of the presentation.
Yep. Um
These are the those three right there, those slides right there are the three landscape plan slides exhibits. That's the overall tree plan. The master landscape plan.
Well I you I thought we said there were four trees per lot.
Right. Well they're spaces. Then you've got the planting schedule. This is the plan that g gets you down to the each space. But we also did landscaping outside of where we didn't have any spaces.
So um What uh Well that's a little hard for me to read. I n I just got these new contacts and they're not working for me. Um but I I do have a question I just saw here on page eight of thirteen where it said that the recreational vehicles will be at least ten feet from each other. I I thought we were gonna be w wider than that away from each other. Right.
So the o the R V spa that is a is in there because that's the fire marshal standard, so that's why it says that, but the spaces are bigger than that.
Where does it say they're bigger than that? Where does it where does it say they're further away from each other?
Uh uh we did do some uh plan view uh dimensional exhibits. I don't think those made it into the into this PowerPoint, but there were more along the lines of fifteen to twenty feet. When you actually dimension out those uh those typicals.
Okay.
I think ten feet is the fire fire regulation minimum.
It doesn't seem like very much.
Yeah they're a little close.
I don't know. Professor Morton. You could you could hear your neighbors talking.
Well you I will I will say this, concerning the amount that I've been to and we've stayed at
This is pretty extreme. As in we're your what whoever's proposal this is is you're making 'em do a lot compared to normal. And I've stayed at Dozens and dozens and dozens different ones in my lifetime and I've never been at one where you cannot see your neighbor. At the most upper High scale RV parks there are. You can always see the person next to you. There's never the trees are never that close together. You would have to have a hedge.
Well I
don't Yeah,
I don't know. This isn't a screen in between the two, it's a planting bed.
Right. So, you know, but distance wise, I mean distance wise I'd probably say I mean geez, these th thirty percent of them if if we both have a if you get a slide out and you have your canopy out, lots of times they're touching it. quite a few of 'em.
Pretty good.
I f I feel like we've all tweaked this so much, knowing knowing it was gonna be controversial, we tried to Um make it. as the best one that we've seen or we could. Um and I appreciate the tree canopy very much and the landscaping in between. And I think, you know, um this becomes a blueprint for if for R V um facilities, resorts, whatever you call 'em, if we get more Um there's
been a lot of work done on this and we've set a standard. But I think seems pretty high.
From what you see in here, because they only have uh numbers at four point six per acre. Instead of a nine. four o for acre of But besides, you got more room for this type thing. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. This is this is gonna be a very nice point. I don't even Disney doesn't even probably have that much. Okay, so
I've stayed in that one. Um so I did have a question um no, I did want to make a comment and I don't know if the cyclist is still here, but my husband comes in cyc cycles in this area. as do a lot of my friends and you know we we got um Commissioner Oakley before you were elected we we started some work in this area, um hiring I think it was A e com to do some route studies. um for the cyclist because it's always been my hope we will improve some of those roads
that we've designated as the I think we have three different routes that we've designated as the important routes to be sure um our cyclists are encouraged to use and we make them safe for drivers and cyclists. So the shoulder I have checked with our um staff that deal with the cycling safety issues and they are good with with this addition of the six foot shoulder because that route we may had them look
at that study This is the route that the cyclists take. They go uh um up and then turn left on Bayhead, is that what it is?
Uh
now that I have an electric bike I might get out there myself, but there was no way I was doing it on my regular bike. Um but we think we've addressed those concerns.
Okay. Um we need to take public comment?
Does anyone want to speak to this?
Oh yes, I have uh a couple of people signed up.
Okay.
Uh we all take them and this
is line up. It's late in the day in um We will whoever's not in line.
How about we'll just go through the line and then I'll check them off at the end of the day.
And um we'll check him off and if you're not in line after the gentleman in the red shirt. Where okay. I can't say who's last. The gentleman in the red shirt doesn't have to be last.
Okay. So the gentleman in the red shirt is last and if you're not in line You're not speaking. Okay, name and address for the record. And then this one you have to have been sworn. Right.
Yes, I've been sworn. My name is Ashley Battis. I live at [address removed]. Um Can you be sure can
you pull
that
mic closer to you? I Sorry. It's it is hard to hear. It's hard to hear and hear.
Sorry. Um we've lived out here almost six years and we moved here. We're both from Riverview. We're Florida residents, born in Brandon Hospital. Um I don't know if you've been to Riverview lately, but when I was a kid it was very much like this. It was orange groves and pastures and swamp and Now it's just this metropolis of pollution and traffic and crime. So I say that to say this, where does it end? You know, I I understand that this is a a rural area,
so the fact that it's commercial doesn't really fit in, but I think that was the purpose of it being a rural area, was it not? Maybe I'm missing something. I never thought I'd quote my parents, but my dad said there's a time and a place for everything. And we just listened all afternoon of all of the new developments coming in, so why not the place for this project to be somewhere closer to 52? And I don't I hear what they're saying about it being close to seventy
five, but I respectfully um would like to point out that there's an alternate location right across from the lake and it's already zoned commercial and it would alleviate and alley a lot of the concerns for safety and the bicyclists and what have you. S somebody is going to die. It could be one of us in this room. Like it's it's a pretty tricky area and combine that with people that don't know where they're going on that road the way it is. Like you you know,
like the other people have said before me, I've seen numerous crashes. I've seen a helicopter come in and take somebody and I've only been here a few years. Um I just Yeah, this and I hear what you what you had to say, Commissioner Moore. Um th but this is not a state park. There there is no state parks around here, so I appreciate what you brought. to the conversation but this doesn't feel like the same script, if you know what I mean. And the fact that
they bought The fact that they bought agricultural land when there was already zoned commercial land that was ready to go for this project, the fact that they bought c agricultural land for a lesser price leads me to believe that it is more to do with money than anything else. So I I'd like to share that, you know, only when the last tree has died and the last river been poisoned And the last fish have been caught. Well we realize that we cannot eat
money. So I'm done. Thank you.
I've been sworn.
Gail Wright, um, [address removed]. Uh I have my notes and as things have been talking some things have changed. Uh first of all Ласт там і вас та мітін. Uh they were talking about this being changed to recreational. Somehow today it's back to commercial. Um And I looked up the word for commercial 'cause we were told it was not a commercial, it
was recreational. But commercial is viewed with regard to profit, designed for profit, and designed for mass appeal. Sounds like the RV park is right there. Um five hundred fifty sites. I don't know if they mentioned today, but they're gonna put yurts in. They're gonna put camping cabins to attract people that don't have RVs, so now we're running a motel. Uh they're gonna have a restaurant. I
imagine a store, a laundry. I am an RVer. I've been out west several times. Um And to answer your question, Florida State Parks, fifteen day maximum, and then you have to leave and come back if if you can find a spot. It's very difficult during the winter. Um I To quote our ex governor of Alaska. I will be able to see the RV park
from my porch. That's how close I am to it. I am cons very concerned about water. Um A tiny home which these RVs are Use as much water as a single family home. The single family home has its own well. We're gonna have five hundred fifty. Tiny homes there. Drawing water. uh bathrooms, showers, laundry, washing dishes.
uh two pools, a splash pond, and by the way, when water is thrown up into the atmosphere it evaporates very quickly. Uh there's no reclaim water to water their plants they're gonna spend thousands of dollars on. Um At Lake Drevida it came out that um this company has been known to do this and then sell it down the line and then once it's sold none
of the promises that have been made They have to keep. So who knows what it's gonna end up like. And the big another big concern is that corner down at Blanton. I was there, I heard the traffic person say their solution was they were gonna put Lighted stop signs. What a joke. If anything, that needs a traffic circle. As much as I hate traffic circles It needs a traffic circle.
So if we're gonna have to spend the money I I don't wanna spend the money. Let them pay for a traffic circle to keep this from being a mess. And uh promises made.
Nope.
Promises
kept. Thank you very much. Next.
My name is Bill Lamberson, uh and I've been sworn.
Address.
Oh, sorry, [address removed].
I live about a mile from where this a little a little more than a mile from where this thing is planned. And like most people in this room, I'm opposed to it. mainly because I believe it sets a bad precedent for this Northeast protection overlay plan. We've we've got we're taking this from agricultural to commercial. and who's to say that We don't do that. across
the street or down Bayhead or down Johnson. And Uh I'd just like to to say I have seen the development in my lifetime because I worked in Odessa uh along fifty four and fifty six. And people like myself who live out there We're not interested. in living like that or we would. The people who live out there live out there because they like it.
They like the rural aspect of it. The as somebody else put up there there are no state the closest state park is Kroom. And Uh I'm not an R Ver. 'Cause I stay at home where I like it on my twelve acres. out there. And I I I would like to Point out that Uh a minimum of five hundred more people is gonna put a strain on the emergency
services out there. There's one Uh maybe five miles away from there and there's another one up Monden Hill Road. That's probably that's in Hernando, probably ten miles from there. So That's a concern. 'Cause lots of old people. Not that I'm not one. Uh RV. And no offense to you, sir, your age. Uh
And I I I have a concern with the six months uh
duration. Why couldn't somebody stay there six months? Drive down to the Walmart parking lot, stay overnight in their RV one day, come back and stay another six months. My my main thing is I just hate to see a precedent like this being set. I j I want to thank you all for your time. And uh Well, that's it.
Thank you.
I'll jump it over here.
Good afternoon. Yeah. Alec Benzar [address removed] Less than a thousand. I've been sworn at. Okay. Um there were some numbers. Po not some numbers, some some mentioning of numbers and I just did a quick Google search. Apparently the Yellowstone National Park has about twenty one hundred campsites. Um now the area of Yellowstone National Park is 2.2 million acres. We're talking about 130
plus acres here and over 500 uh campsites, just to put in perspective. Um the other concern of the question that I had was there is discussions about the zoning and you know the Northeast Pasco Rural Protection Area and the fact that it relates to residential and not commercial. I just heard, and correct me if I'm wrong, there is discussions and work being done on the commercial aspect which has not been finalized. So my question is isn't
it prudent to work that out first before proceeding in, you know, rezoning this area. Just trying to make sure that everything is done proper by the book and, you know, there is avoidance of any potential legal fees and more headaches to come both to the county and to the local area. That's all.
Thank you.
Hi, my name is Alma Coston. I live at [address removed]. And I was here before the comp plan for Northeast Pasco was even considered and I was voting on issues with county commissioners so I'll go back probably Thirty years. And what my There's a couple of things I like to mention. For one thing is Do you know that for fifteen years, every year we've approached the county, county commissioners to form
a commercial Overlay from Northeast Pasco since 2006 and every year we've been asked And we've been pushed aside and say no there's more important things in Pasco County Then you're commercial. And now our commercial is totally out. We don't even have a commercial. Uh plan for for Northeast Pasco Another thing too, in northeast Pasco, the height of a building is supposed to be no more than
35 feet. They're proposing fifty five feet, which is almost double. And I think the most crucial thing is the safety of the Pasco County residents. is that when they get on that interstate, you have to slow down on the interstate to probably sixty miles an hour. You're still on the interstate and cars are going 70 plus. So then when you get that curve, it's a hundred and eighty degree curve that you have to get. And I and I have seen witness vehicles down
that gully where they did not make that curve and it was just a single vehicle. It wasn't something that was towing an RV on the back. And for safety reasons I don't think this should be approved. And even if you did approve it, I think it should be cut in half from five fifty to two hundred and twenty five at the most. And I think that it's a crime that Pasco County has not developed a Commercial plan for the north northeast Pasco area. I think it's it's just
terrible that they haven't done that. And are we less than any part of the other county? Are we less important than the rest of the county?
Thank you.
Nancy Hazewood, [address removed]. I appreciate your indulgence and thoughtfulness, thank you. Um, I wanna remind you that when you're on seventy five, you're gonna be able to see the center of this RV because it's on a hill. And so um I was wondering what kind of trees were going to be in between this. So if I could get a listing of that, it'd be appreciative. Or
just tell me what kind of more trees are gonna be there would be good. Uh yeah, we don't want you to think that we have we say no to everything. If you had brought us like the RVs they put in a state park or national park, we'd be perfectly happy. They're nicely done. But as somebody was saying, this one's very intense. Two pools, splash pad, lodge, two pickleball courts, tennis court, entertainment area, convenience store, laundry, dog park,
grill Two girls in bars, probably. Lodge, clubhouse. That's they don't do that in state parks that I've seen. Well, it's one state park, Hillsbury River's got one pool. And one place to eat. So and with all those RV places you've seen on 301, I see 'em too. We always thought that in the Northeast Rural area, Highway 301, Dade City was gonna be where all the density and intensity
went, so the rest of the area could be open and beautiful. And we would love to see this on 301. We think it's the perfect area for it to go. So, um one more thing. Travelers rest is a lot larger than this, so they didn't have to cram everything together. And they happened to have a very nice looking golf course out front. Thank you.
Lisa Mari, [address removed]. I requested extra time today.
And you were sworn in? Yes, I was sworn. We said that um to get extra time that there needed to be people who were willing to give up their time for you. But they guys but
I was not told that. When I requested extra time.
It's all right.
Um
I'll
do my best. I'll
be fast. You are fast. Do you need something to motion?
Motion to receive and file. Second.
All in favor? Aye.
Aye.
So first thing I would like to ask is that you consider the public comments that were submitted from people in the previous hearing piece uh as part of this as well. Their observations are meaningful and um As you know, everybody's had a hard time keeping these two pieces. Even you guys have had a hard time keeping them separate. So I would ask that you consider comments from the community in both places.
Did you have a question for me?
No, I just that I wanted to adjust I want we wanted to address how you can s what the qualifications are to speak for a group. So I had talked to him about this yesterday and I just realized I didn't get it.
Okay.
So go ahead.
Um I would like to note that at the Planning Commission meeting, Attorney Goldstein had previously stated that this project wasn't residential, nor was it commercial. So um It seems that we have a lot of nebulous definitions running about with this project, and I would ask you to continue it until you get those definitions in place. Here are some of the things that are Bothersome. This is now listed as a RV condo resort and has a condo homeowners association. I asked
the county for a definition of what an RV condo space is because I couldn't find anything in our own stuff or in the Florida statutes. Apparently there is no definition for that. So, what I did look up was what is a condominium? It's a single family ownership dwelling that has at least one similar unit within the same building structure. And it says the exemption of a multifamily dwelling from the definition of a vacation rental should not be construed as authorizing multifamily dwellings to be operated as hotels, motels, or other transient lodging establishments. So In that sense
it is residential. It also has a commercial component. So it could also be considered multifamily because when you go camping, sometimes you like to bring your friends, other family members. And um I've even in college stuffed 20 people into an RV and gone to a nice upscale park. And what's going to prevent that from happening here? What rules are in place? We don't know. And I have questions about what the entitles are for somebody as a condo owner. Will they vote in our elections? Will they pay root for the road abuse? How about
emergency services? What about schools? What about police and enforcement? How will these owners contribute to the costs that we taxpayers already contribute to? Snowbirds that come to our area that stay here for less than six months also pay dearly for those services. These people will not. Um I did a quick little bit of math there, and at $65 a day for 30 days in a month times six months. Somebody's basically getting home ownership for $12,000. I think that's ludicrous and I think it's insulting to all of
us. I wanted to note that the interstate does not dictate urban density, as Ms. Marina has said. Traffic isn't at its peak impact on Lake Iola Road Monday from 7 a.m. to 9 a.m. and Friday from 4 to 6. So I think your traffic models are really cruddy because they don't include traffic when. traffic happens on Lake Iola Road, which is on Saturdays and Sundays. That's when our density is. So we can talk all about these traffic patterns and traffic models and how the road's designed to handle it, but you're not using the right data to look at what
is actually happening on the road. So I think that's a problem. Um trying to edit while I talk. Uh you've heard over and over again why and asked us why we don't bother showing up and you saw everybody get up and leave after you made the first decision. Everybody thinks that this is like a done deal. Everybody feels like I interrupted you,
so you have another fifteen seconds. Okay.
Um I think it's unfortunate that everyone feels that we aren't listened to. Rather than ruin our treasured rural byways and neighborhoods, I encourage you to do the right thing. The developer knew what he was getting into when he bought the land. No entitlements, no zoning, no special new comp plan policies. He purchased a rural residential piece of land, rural ag land. And any expectation beyond that is just a wish and when does it include our desires for our community? When do we get represented? Thank you. Thank you.
And our last speaker. We have no one online. No one online puts it. Okay. Thank you.
Hi, I'm Jim Wiegan. Last name is W-E-I-G-A-N-D. I live at [address removed]. Uh as I understand it I don't need to be sworn in. Is that correct? You
need to be sworn in for this hearing, yes.
Oh okay, well then I need to be sworn in.
All right, please raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you're about to give is the truth, so help you God?
I do.
Thank you.
Uh I am the treasurer of Travels Rest Resort Inc. I was not planning on talking today or I would address nicer. Uh but I do think I need to correct the statement that was made previously. Um Traveler's Rest has approximately 550 RV sites. We have approximately a little less than 150 homes. Manufactured homes. So our total number of units is just under seven hundred. So We like to say we during the busy
season we have twelve hundred to fourteen hundred people, so my guess is that somebody Told you something that wasn't quite accurate, but I wanted to make sure that the record was correct as we do not have fifteen hundred sites. We have five hundred and fifty approximately R V and approximately little less than a hundred and fifty homes. Uh the other thing is is that I may have missed it, but I think they were going to describe the safety solution to Lake Iola and Blanton Roads and I don't think I heard that yet, so I'm very interested to
hear what that is because that has been my primary concern on this whole issue. Thank you.
Thank you. Um I can I ask you a question? Yes. Um What's the name of the Travelers Rest? Travelers Rest
Resort Inc.
Okay, is that a travel resort?
Yeah, it is an R V and manufactured home resort with a golf course.
So do the do they travel? Do they leave every six months?
Uh We have people that live there year round and people that travel.
Yeah, I'm not sure is that like did that get built? Well okay. I wanna ask my attorney the question.
Thank you. I I am not I'm not actually here representing the
predates me.
So but if you Yeah.
Yes, I believe that's correct. I'm not an attorney and I'm not here technically representing Traveler's Rust, so I would want to make a statement on their behalf.
Okay.
Okay?
Yeah, but thank you.
When did those rules come in place? Do you know?
Okay. I just will keep doing my research. I have some travelers parks in my district where no one travels. I got a lot I got a little issue with that. Uh Barbara.
Barbara Will Hyde, 6327, Grand Boulevard for the applicant. Um Mr. County Attorney, so you heard Miss Moretti say can we have everything that was said and done in the first hearing be this be the record for this hearing as well? That keeps us from having to meet media and Miss Marino up here and have the same conversation again. So is that workable or should I go ahead and have Miss Marina come up and address the same things about residential versus commercial?
I you can incorporate the record from your legislative hearing into your quasi judicial hearing. I I'm fine with it.
Well and then it was requested sound now by both of us, so we'd like to do that. Thank you. Um based upon that I I don't have anything specific 'cause all these things are the same things we already talked about, um, in the previous record. So If you have any questions, I'm happy to answer them, but I didn't hear anything new.
Um so the things that we need to do up here to memorialize some things is uh my understanding is make is nothing taller than a two story? Two stories, correct. Maximum height two stories. And I'm not sure w what I heard about the previous so are these poured concrete pads or are they landscape paver pads? Concrete Concrete block pads.
Well we don't have any s particular design exactly how we're gonna do it yet, but there are concrete pads and then there are paver pads. And there are some that I think could be concrete with papers on them. It's all depending on how that design's done. for weight of those um of the uh R Bs. But from a d stormwater design we're gonna treat any of our surfaces, whether it's concrete or it's asphalt or it's because our dry our dry vials will be asphalt, Or if it's pavers,
we're going to treat them as all impervious. Um, so that that'll mean more stormwater design, even though we could have a debate whether things are pervious or impervious.
Okay, and did I hear you say that forty five percent of this is open space?
My team looked at it again today and at least forty five percent is open space, and our concept plan is binding.
Okay, does anyone else have any questions? Yes. Mike make sure to get things yeah.
Okay, I know you said it would be a maximum of two story, but it's a maximum of fifty-five feet as well due to the structure.
So I think the best way is it's two stories, and then if it's got whatever its roof is, it's still just two stories.
It's still a maximum of fifty five feet though, it won't go above that due to the aesthetics and the arch and the pitches, which you originally agreed that it was only fifty-five feet. Sure, I mean
we could write it that way. Two stories not to expand.
But it's still maximum of two stories.
Two stories not to exceed fifty five. Maybe Brad can help out here.
Hi, Brad Tippen. Uh for implementation purposes downstream we prefer that to be a number of feet so that when they come in for building permits and things like that they can see a number and say it doesn't go above this. Uh but you can write it with a maximum number of stories and a maximum number of feet. For reference, all residential agricultural, thirty-five feet is the maximum. Uh general commercials fifty-five to sixty feet. uh in other areas. So that's kind of the range that it would be.
So is it a maximum of thirty-five or fifty-five feet?
For residential it's thirty-five. For commercial, it's anywhere between fifty-five and sixty. In some areas there's no height restriction at all. But that's just to give you an idea. It can kind of fall anywhere within there that you and the applicant agree on.
So you'll keep your maximum fifty-five feet? Yes. Or two stories? Two stories,
fifty-five feet.
Thank you. And what is an R V condo space?
I was just gonna ask that too.
mine you can do a con R V condo well condo a condo's ownership. So you can condo those R V spaces. So that's what that is. I don't have a lot of information 'cause I don't do any condominium work. But there are RV resorts that have their spaces set up as condominiums.
Okay, so that raises the question if you've got a six month able to be able to be used, why would you why would anybody buy are you planning on doing a land condo for your spaces?
No.
So that so that information in the record is is not preclude.
It's not precluded? Okay. It's we says we can't subdivide, but it didn't say no you couldn't do a condominium Um on the R B spaces.
There can't be permanent. basically somebody there twenty four seven, three hundred and sixty five days a year, and you sell it to somebody unless you're planning on something like a condotel where it's the spaces are rented but you have ownership of the
So North the same language shows up in the Anclot Resort. And that's and it's that is the that is that allowance that you could Put it. in a hotel pool, but they're ultimately done like a condo hotel. Um if they're
rented like a like a normal R V park. But there might be there might be an ownership interest in the pad.
That's what I've seen, yeah.
Okay. Yeah, I understand. Would that make it more confusing for you commissioners? So
there are gonna be R V condo spaces in this?
Providing for that the eventually that they could do that if that was the model they decided to
blue water down the keys is that way and and we took the language from Anclote.
But if there's someone parked the same R V and it stays there year round? No. No. No, that's prohibited. That's clearly clearly prohibited. Yeah.
But then there's six months of the pad not being utilized and we're not collecting a bed tax?
Yeah, we'll leave it out to somebody else coming there.
You can they can sell the pad. But then the pad would be operated Like The best example is th there are hotels that do this. They sell the hotel room. Right. But when you come in to rent a room like NS you don't know that it's not a hotel. Oh
like Saddlebok.
So the so the rental the the the rules that were described about it having to be transient will be transient whether or not the space is owned by somebody who is then renting it.
Yeah. Okay, and following the money and you cannot speak from the gallery. Um if someone buys a c uh uh a condo space, who's collecting the bed tax? 'Cause if there were a lot of individual condo spaces And they're ma and it's being managed by the individual person, how will we know that the tax
they're all still managed by the by the overall person that operates the
RV
part?
I still may have more. You know, short term rentals can be Tough to chase down. Tax wise.
It's in our conditions that we have to pay the tourist tax and we're gonna be paying the tourist tax. So it's specifically written in um even for the condo ones. Anything we're doing there has to pay the the tourist tax. Commissioner Oakley.
Move approval.
With discussion. Uh
quick.
Okay. Well I know they brought up the water cycle. Is there a second?
Second. Did you have a transmutation question?
No, I had a question on that too. I got it. Go ahead, Commissioner Oakley.
Okay, I
know
they brought up the water cycle and the splash pads and again that would be recycled bo recyclable water. So that was being addressed. Due to public safety. 550 units would probably have one to two people, so that would be two new law enforcements in that area that they would need. So I do want to take that into consideration. We have the track um I am concerned about the traffic study. Do you have someone to speak about the traffic? For Blandon and Lake Iola. So that intersection
If you heard Mr. Henry, what he did. Um But the n what you really want to hear is if you want to hear it is from your traffic operations because They looked at it at Commissioner Oakley's request and and there were several meetings. So if you want to hear you you gotta hear from your guy, Vencat and Traffic Operations. Due to having two
auto accidents is there and life threatening, I would like
to hear. Ben Kat from Traffic Operations, I've heard him speak. I've listened to him. He he's he's done the study on all the traffic crashes. He's no he's got it. exactly what he knows all the data and he has what his conclusions based upon that. So um I that's your staff did that analysis for Ms. for Commissioner Oakley.
And is there a stipulation that if in the future there are RVs or this area is affected due to the R V resort that they will take an
So the way the way that your staff wanted to handle it was we pay our Mobility fees and then if something needs to be done they have the money to do it. It goes with it's it's for them. They don't want to like presuppose how to spend that money. They wanna go through it methodically. and make sure that it's needed to be spent and then spent accordingly. So that's how they wanted to handle it, which I makes sense to me. Okay, and my last is I think you've got your staff person there that wants to be a little bit more than a little bit.
Okay.
It comes in problems now and direct and so on and you know. But I just want to give you a small bit on intersection number two, if I'm not.
Okay, I didn't understand the word you said.
What's the specific question? What's the specific question?
The traffic concern at Lake Iola and Lanton, which he was about to say.
Do
you have issues of that intersection?
Based on what Right mentioned, we really collect the fee. We're going to use that to make any future modifications by our need.
Okay. Okay, so the mobility fees are there just in case. And the only last thing that I am concerned about is setting a precedent and because we don't have a commercial zoning and we have been waiting for fifteen years, that is concerning to me because there's hasn't been anything set in place and I don't want this to be a precedent case for future development.
Well I think there's a couple things there. That's why I recommended that finding a fact. To be added to your ordinance, so that's the reason why to your comp plan change. So you had a fact of why you did that. I think you also have all sorts of standards which will probably exceed whatever commercial stand design standards that you would ever adopt because as you've heard staff say normally the commercial standards are less than the residential standards or maybe that was Ms. Marino. The commercial standards are less stringent than the residential standards and we took the residential standards and and even made them
harder. We we went exceeded those residential standards. So We actually are a pretty good blueprint for what you should do from a design standard perspective 'cause we've addressed Everything. Um and then you have that for the record, in your ordinance when you adopted the comp plan change for this project, you have a finding of fact that's a very limiting finding of fact. So that's I think I understand your concern and I'm happy to work on commercial design standards and comment on them and act as a stakeholder and do all
those things, but I think that's how I would address your concern regarding this particular project.
Thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to work with the community and the citizens going back and forth. Um I just also don't feel that this is the original expectations of the Northeast Rural Area Protection Plan. So that is the only concern. Thank you. Yeah.
Okay. We have a a motion and a second. Um all is this a this is not a rule comment. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Nay. Okay, uh three and one and Okay, um so we're done with that. I d um board members I did want to bring up something that I did not bring up with my commissioner items. Um I have asked the county attorney to send to all of us the um the policy we have to