Commissioner updates panhandling CARES and fire rescue

2:11:37Hey, Mr. Chairman Mariano.

2:11:41We c we kinda finished my thing before we broke for the meeting. I I I was gonna go, but I it was twelve oh two.

2:11:47Okay.

2:11:48Um One of the one of the people came up and uh was talking about panhandlers. You see 'em up and down, especially the nineteenth. Um they're in the right-of-way. If the Sheriff's Office can't handle it, I don't know if we can look at it better, if there's another ordinance to go look at to do something more, but I mean, it just is it's not good for the image of the county. And when there's so many people out there or so many companies out there looking to hire people I mean, I think that's a good thing I I just think we sh we need to do something more.

2:12:17Well um when I was down at FAC um One of the gentlemen I gonna I think he's from Lake County. Um that I s had dinner with said that they passed That their attorneys looked at the new Supreme Court laws and whatever and they passed a panhandling ordinance that um is a safety panhandling ordinance and it's working well for them. So I'm thinking it's It's the vice chair of my federal committee, so I can look that up and see what county he's from, but

2:12:48They they think they've got a a a winning ordinance so maybe the attorney can talk to their

2:12:53ordinance.

2:13:02It's Safety is probably the only way that you're going to be able to to

2:13:10do something and we already actually sort of have that in place. So I'll look and see what they did differently from from what we've got.

2:13:20Uh

2:13:20and

2:13:20I did hear Fort Myers, I think it might have been also past one too, so we can go compare what they did. Sure. Uh re that was recently probably. Fort

2:13:27Myers or Lee County or Charlotte. Which one is that?

2:13:29Uh it's somewhere down south. It might have been I thought it might have been Fort Myers, but it Lee County? Okay.

2:13:37When I was also driving down nineteen, the panhandlers were in the middle of the road. They're not allowed to and I understand that. But they're literally in the middle of the road. You gotta call. The um

2:13:49when you see a panhandler in the road you got to call the um The sheriff's office, the uh not the emergency nine one one, but the other one, and they'll come out and get them out of there.

2:13:59No, that's not happening.

2:14:01Well, Alex. We shouldn't have to call though. Y'all should see it, right? Maybe you can pass it on. Well

2:14:08let's let's let's uh Alex, you wanna come up for a minute? Sorry to know you were there still.

2:14:19I mean if they're in the right away. And uh deputy's driving by. Is are they looking at 'em, are they talking to 'em? Because I mean I see 'em continually, Bekwa's Drive, U S fi uh nineteen and fifty two, further down the road at uh other intersections, they're continually out there.

2:14:35Uh so Alexander all, Intergovernmental Affairs Officer for the uh Pasco Sheriff's Office. So, yeah, so if they are in the right-of-way, if they are not impeding the flow of traffic or causing a safety concern with traffic. then there isn't a uh trespassable issue there with them being in the right way. Now if they are crossing into the street, like Commissioner Starkey was saying. then yes, that would be a safety concern there. If they are impeding the flow of traffic and standing out in the road, yes. Uh

2:15:05but not just the right away on its own.

2:15:08But they can't stand in the median.

2:15:11So as long as they're not impeding the flow of traffic or causing a safety concern by standing there. then under this ruling They are allowed to with the the f it's a protected First Amendment, right, that under this ruling.

2:15:24Is there any speed limit requirements of a median that's safe to stand in?

2:15:29I I'm not sure. That one I can d I can double check if there is, but I'm not sure if there is a speeding requirement there. Especially

2:15:36with the width of the median, if the median's only two feet wide. I mean that's a safety. And the gentleman that I saw, person that I saw in the middle of the road, they were literally in the middle of the road on the dotted lines.

2:15:51Okay, so then if that's if they're in the road in that case, then yes that could be something that uh, as the commissioner's saying, you can call and let us know that they're out there and if we get out there and they're still there and they're causing a safety concern there, then we can address it and to the Commissioner Mariano's point, they would go out there and try to talk to them first, offer them services to get them out of that location so they're not there anymore. and they'll they'll go through that process of trying to help them so they're not going back out there uh on

2:16:21a daily basis.

2:16:23But the issue is if someone calls And you don't see them in the middle of the road.

2:16:30And that's so that's the thing with with Flora statute, it requires that we witness it. So we have to go out and do it. see it. So we get a report, we'll go investigate the report of of a concern like this and we have to get out there and and see it happening.

2:16:46And that comes back to deputizing some of our code m code enforcement officers not only to maybe enforce this or enforce the illegal boating on lakes or also to enforce the illegal handicap parking or parking on the handicap stripes.

2:17:07So the question is, Commissioner, the question is really not if The code enforcement deputies do not have to be

2:17:18um do not have to be deputized by the sheriff to enforce county ordinance. That's their job.

2:17:28Don't think the sheriff is going to be deputizing code enforcement officers to enforce state statute, because that's their job. So

2:17:37And what about the handicap parking? If someone's illegally parked in handicap parking, 'cause I know I've had this conversation with staff.

2:17:45So so uh f Commissioner for handicap parking, that's another that's something else that if there's a port of it and we get a call about it, we would investigate and look into if we catch somebody parking illegally in handicap parking, then that would go through like the ticketing and for citation process.

2:18:03And then the last one would be for an example on Moon Lake when they have people that are Breaking the law, going around the buoys and things like that, if we already have a code enforcement officer on scene daily, then why not deputize one of them so we don't have to just call law enforcement every time if they're already at the park?

2:18:24Um so I I haven't spoken with the sheriff on on deputizing uh d code enforcement, so I'm not I can't speak to that, but Um if we do see if we're out there and we do see or we get a report uh of people doing things like that, that is something we would investigate and look into and uh if either again the first thing we would try to do is educate and let them know if make sure they're aware they're doing something incorrect or they're not supposed to be doing that. If there's a if there's a continual issue, then that would go forward

2:18:54with if a citation is required or something like that.

2:18:57It's a continuant issue, especially when we have to keep replacing the buoys at the county expense because people are out there illegally damaging county property. So and again that's why I'm mentioning it. Because They're already at the location of the violations.

2:19:18Gotcha. Uh yeah and I would be happy to to share that with our um With our uh Marine unit. So they're aware at that location you said that's Moon Lake?

2:19:27Correct.

2:19:27Okay, gotcha. Okay.

2:19:29Mr. Chairman Mariano.

2:19:33Okay, I'll just ask. So from what I'm hearing, from what our count County Attorney just said, our code enforcement can enforce this panhandling ordinance. So I would like to see our code enforcement team Take it off the sheriff's burden. And every every time we see one, if we want to call it in, that we have a code enforcement person go out and Let them go and force it.

2:19:54Yeah I didn't say that. The The code the panhandling ordinance that you have that basically is in violation of the Supreme Court order

2:20:06To enforce. That's not what I said.

2:20:08Well, okay. You didn't go that far, but you did say our code enforcement can enforce our ordinance. Or

2:20:12our ordinances,

2:20:13yes.

2:20:13But the reason the sheriff is not enforcing this is i i is the one that you've got on the books was basically struck down. It And will be struck down if you if you try to enforce it. Okay, then I'm gonna ask you to to go

2:20:26check those other ordinance to bring another one back that will work.

2:20:29Yeah.

2:20:30Um last last just two things. Um Commissioner Moore, thank you for bringing it up as far as the uh waiver the fees to the cares. It's a uh great event. October sixteen and seventeen, the CARES Beach Charity. Festival at Sunwest Park. Should be an awesome time. There's another one coming up, uh November twelfth, thirteen, and fourteen. uh Soraya Fest and um that should be another one good another good one as well. Thank you very much.

2:20:56Thank you.

2:20:58Yeah. Is that everything?

2:21:03Madam Clerk?

2:21:04Um I don't have anything. Thank you.

2:21:06Okay. Let's run me. Um

2:21:13I don't really have anything either. Except for one thing. I thank everybody for doing their job. I thank for all uh staff and All of our employees that do their job each and every day 'cause uh Without y'all doing that, this county wouldn't become closer and closer to being a premier county, so Uh I would like to announce that uh Chuck Caredon has been uh selected as the general manager for Tampa Bay Water, which is Well he started out in Pasco County. His

2:21:43first six years of working was in Pasco County and He's been with Tampa Bay Water ever since and this past week just became the general manager. Or Tampa Bay Water. So It's a very good move and we look forward to working with him. And he's he's been reaching out to us. He'll he'll actually be coming out to uh speak to the board from time to time. So we appreciate that. With that, that's all I have. And

2:22:08Chairman

2:22:08Mope

2:22:09I know I mentioned it, but I thought that Mr. Riles was gonna go, so I didn't want to interrupt before

2:22:14oh but he's

2:22:14the I had a couple additional

2:22:16okay

2:22:17From if you can pull up the photos. I had a couple photos of the carefest, which this was the before photo and then after was cleaning helping clean up the yard so that they can utilize the different the dogs and go outside with the handicap and disabled. Um there was a lady in a walker that wasn't able to tend to her yard, so it was nice to see the different organizations and churches go out and help clean up the yards for These people. And then

2:22:47the next photos were from Palm Beach and just some of the roadways and that was the median in the middle of the road where you can't even see the other side. And then of course the roadways on the side of the road when you have the different developments you still have the nice greenery and landscaping. Um I wanted to thank uh Mike Carbales team and Donald Carey because they had an LICO

2:23:18PASS project with the flood and mitigation and it's moving forward to the next steps of design permitting and construction. So they are ex happy and excited about that. And I would like to know. I don't know if we have an update I had rescinded the motion to remove the chip seal and to move forward with the full depth reclamation for Aresida and I didn't know what the pro where we were on that.

2:23:49So we met briefly with the Aristida HOA A couple of weeks ago, I believe, and uh public works was going to meet on site with the HOA representatives to get some of the major drainage issues uh addressed and and looking at those first before we move forward with any sort of PVAS.

2:24:08Okay. Thank you. And lastly, I did as running the numbers and looking through the budget, um, do you have the slide? 'Cause it was looking we could save possibly one point eight. No, you don't have to show that. I wanted it on a PDF. Um okay. So looking at the numbers for fire rescue, if we're paying twelve additional average Additional time and a half salaries a day. That consists of one thousand ninety-six dollars and eighty cents

2:24:38per day for twelve. Firefighters to work time and a half, which is thirteen thousand dollars roughly a day, multiplied by three hundred and sixty-five days a year, that would mean we're paying overtime in four point eight million dollars. Now, if we were to take those twelve people, multiply it by the seven days, and divide it by the two point three three. So you would Long story short, you would get thirty six New s employees, full

2:25:08time employees. Their loaded benefits would be eighty-two thousand three hundred and ninety one dollars, which would mean thirty six employees multiplied for the loaded benefits would be two point nine million dollars. It would be a cost savings for our residents of one point eight million dollars, so one million eight hundred and thirty seven thousand nine hundred and eight dollars. So I would like to look at the cost and even if we reallocated the one point one one five million dollars of the overtime costs for the firefighters

2:25:38for their overtime and hire the new employees, it would be moving the line items over, but we would be having the additional savings of up to $1.8 million. So I would like t to take time to look at that or reconsider it next time at the board meeting. to move forward.

2:25:55Mr. Chairman Mariano. Can you just out of curiosity is that's what so we're all aware, where exactly did you get that information from and who did you get it from?

2:26:03I was speaking with Chief Caseon and I was looking at it was originally an average of nine People and it was an average of nine overtime employees. If they were if someone had called out, they would have to go and ask for volunteers. If there were not volunteers, they would have to do a mandate instead of having a 24 hour shift on and a 48 hour shift off. They were working additional Days. So instead of them working a twenty-four, they were working a forty-eight

2:26:34hour shift. Okay. And then we would end up having to pay them an additional $1,096 a day. And if we have an average Of twelve people calling in and we're having to fill those in with other firefighters for overtime, we're paying thirteen thousand dollars a day in overtime, which accumulates to four point eight million dollars a year. So instead of paying all of that overtime, if we were to able to hire thirty-six

2:27:05employees. employees at eighty two thousand dollars loaded benefits, it It would be two point two million nine hundred and sixty six thousand and seventy six dollars, which would be the total savings cost of one million eight hundred and thirty seven thousand nine hundred and eight dollars.

2:27:22So this is a request from Chief Casson to you to bring to the board?

2:27:25No, this is me going in, asking questions, looking at numbers and how to save funds across the board, especially when we have a lot of people.

2:27:37And I called other people to

2:27:39Who else

2:27:39did you talk to,

2:27:40out of curiosity, that gave you those numbers?

2:27:44I Have an email from Chief Caseon regarding because I specifically asked what is the loaded cost of an employee and then I calculated the numbers on what is because I was really curious about the breakeven analysis and what would the breakeven analysis be from us having to pay overtime to having additional employees. And really if we were to hire the amount of we paid in overtime, we would have probably

2:28:14fifty employees.

2:28:15Okay. So I I was just curious, I just wondered where not that your numbers are wrong by any means, I just wondered where they came from since they're not just in the public

2:28:34And I even had it broken up for twelve people average per day is forty five dollars and seventy cents per hour and I took that multiply by twenty four hour shifts that they have to work, which is one thousand ninety six dollars and eighty cents. And then you have multiply And that by the twelve people multiplied by the three hundred and sixty five days a year.

2:28:55And H R confirm those numbers?

2:28:58I will confirm with HR.

2:29:00Okay, I'm just curious this way we know. I mean Mr. Biles might be able to step in, but

2:29:04We looked at this as part of the budget process and There is a variance of overtime that is gonna exist regardless of how many firefighters we hire to do the twenty four hour forty eight shift. And So the average is nine. Call outs a day, which is less than five percent of the workforce every day, which is well within the industry average variance for call-outs in a day. We work through the numbers. The the challenge is there are as many days where you're over that as you're under that, which means you will then be hiring

2:29:35people that you will have on shift which aren't filling a role. that day. Because the nine is an average. Sometimes it can be higher, sometimes it can be two. And so you ha still have people you've hired now that are on shift and aren't actually filling a role in a fire station. So we we work through these numbers between the fire rescue and the budget. And Or comfortable with what we're recommending that you will see and hopefully vote on this afternoon at five fifteen. We will continue to work on 'em every year like we do, starting

2:30:05in about January to continue to work on the budget and see what changes we need to make to see if there are other efficiencies. But in general you know, what we have is have been vetted between fire rescue and budget. To to To deliver the best product that we can for the resources given to them.

2:30:23And do you have the number for the actual overtime expense that we paid out for last year? Because if we can hire additional firefighters and reduce the number of overtime By finding that break even analysis we could save our citizens. Like

2:30:36I said, fire rescue and budget. Work through all that math and looked at it. there is a variance of overtime you are gonna have every day. if I hire thirty firefighters to cover the nine, and I have zero call outs, then what do I do with the nine firefighters that are supposed to be on duty that day?

2:30:54Well there's an average of three people three firefighters per fire truck and I believe per standard, it's actually supposed to be four. So if we did have additional people, we could add them to an additional fire truck. Or as we grow, instead of hiring new firefighters at that time, we can put them into the new fire stations and already have them prepared, vetted and knowing what's what at the different locations.

2:31:22Yeah, is it You you have our recommendation. We will look at this as part of the budget process again next year and we will make adjustments as needed as we look at efficiencies in the process.

2:31:32So my only concern is if we're paying out four million dollars in overtime when we can hire the additional staff and save two million dollars, then why would we not do that?

2:31:43I don't think that's a real number. Based on our analysis that we've done with our rescue and budget.

2:31:50I'll be more than happy to share the numbers and e with everyone.

2:31:55Right? Is that everything? Thank you.