CPAS 2407 Little Road Plan Amendment to commercial

56:11So the final item is APC fourteen.

56:27Good afternoon. Amy Toll with Planning Development and Economic Growth. Today you'll be hearing a proposed small-scale comprehensive plan amendment in the name of CPAS 2407 Little Road Plan Amendment. So, as stated, the proposal is a small-scale comprehensive plan amendment. The applicants proposing a future land use change from RES One, residential one dwelling unit per gross acre to Calm Commercial to allow or on 3.12 acres to

56:57allow for commercial development. There is also a proposed voluntary deed restriction on this site as well. is located at the northeast corner of it the intersection of Jasmine Boulevard and Little Road. So, as stated, there is a proposed voluntary deed restriction. The voluntary deed restriction will include the language to ensure that the commercial site would be utilized for commercial development or commercial uses only, and not for residential uses in accordance

57:27with the LIBE Local. Additionally, there are prohibited uses that will be included in the voluntary deed restriction. As you can see on the screen, I can go through them. The proposed uses are standalone car washes, cabinet and chementry shops, pre-owned vehicle sales or leasings, self-storage facilities, standalone warehousing and general storage, separate from that required by individual businesses, and including sales and office, auto repair

57:58garages, lumber yards, standalone laundry. Mower sales and repairs, mortuaries or funeral homes, crematories, standalone outdoor pottery, and statute sales or statue sales, propane sales, septic tank sales, and installation businesses. However, propane sales are allowed as a secondary use, sod sales, shooting and archery ranges, freestanding recreational vehicles, automotive towing and connected. Storage of vehicles and gas stations.

58:29These voluntary deed restrictions as of September 10th were acknowledged by the applicant and agreed to. However, on September 30th, the applicant has requested to remove the gas stations from this prohibited use list. Planning, development, and economic growth is not in support of removing gas stations. From this site or from the voluntary deed restriction on this site. So given that information, there may be a potential alternative recommendation at the end of the presentation.

58:59So subject site is located in the embassy district of the Westmarket area and within the urban service area. Here is the context map showing the subject site. As you can see, it's located at the intersection of Jasmine Boulevard and Little Road. There is office development to the south, the neighborhood commercial use to the west, and

59:22surrounding low density to the east with higher density to the west. There's also Fox Hollow Elementary in the general location. So for purposes of depicting The gas station component. We did provide a context map to identify all of the existing gas stations in a five-mile radius. So as you can see, the nearest gas station is to the south, which is about a mile and a half away. There's one, two, three, four, five gas stations. South of that, to the

59:52nearest intersection, to the north, you have about four gas stations. Um in proximity within 1.7 to 2.1 miles within this subject site. So I'll give you a moment to take a look.

1:00:10This is the air aerial. Did I need to go back?

1:00:14No, I just have a question, but I'll wait till you're done. Go ahead. Sorry.

1:00:18So that was the aerial. This is going to be your existing transportation network. Again, Jasmine Boulevard, Little Road intersection. There is the Little Road Trail that is located along that site or located along this segment. Here's the visual representation of the existing reswan flu. Here's what the proposed future land used to comm would look like. The subject site, I think this is very important to also highlight, it is currently zoned PO2, which is your office or higher intensity office development

1:00:48zone interstate.

1:00:52So Given the recommendation from Planning Development and Economic Growth. With our proposal, we would highlight that it would be consistent with the following policies within the comprehensive plan.

1:01:08And we would recommend that the local planning agency find the proposed amendment consistent with the comprehensive plan, subject to the voluntary deed restriction prohibiting the incompatible uses. However, alternatively, the PDE action would be to find the proposed amendment inconsistent with the comprehensive plan should the allowable uses on the site include a gas station.

1:01:30So what would be well. For two years. I've been sitting up here feeding this horse and I knew this day would come. When the voluntary deed restriction was no longer voluntary. And now we've got it in writing.

1:01:49So what part of the comp plan are they violating by not agreeing to voluntarily deed restrict? A gas station. And I gotta say right now I'm not in favor of putting a gas station on this site, but I wanna know what part of the comp plan Are they violate would they be in violation of By proposing a gas station here. in a C two zoning district if I assume that's what they'd be going for if we were to change the land use here.

1:02:14So it's actually more about the future land use in this scenario. So commercial would allow for that full range of general commercial uses. So In the analysis, you take into consideration the character of the surrounding area, existing uses within a certain distance. So it's essentially The policy that we're highlighting is 1.10.1, which is your generalized compatibility policy, but however, it's it's more so goal 1.10. And

1:02:44so 1.10 essentially says: evaluate your land use, evaluate your economic impact, evaluate the compatibility of the surrounding area accessibility, those types of components. And so given the research that's staff has conducted on this site. Well

1:03:00then why not see one? Well that was the question I was gonna ask because because

1:03:06Part of the reason I understand why you're annoyed about the voluntary heat restriction, but the only reason that's an issue is because they're seeking C two and not C one. Sure. Because if they were taking C one Many of these users may not be allowed anyway.

1:03:19So I'm not gonna disagree and I will tell you that if they come back here with C two I won't be voting yay, but

1:03:26So I guess we I'm just gonna ask.

1:03:31Shall I go? Planning by omission or or by deletion, why why not just affirmatively say We only recommend approval of C1. Yeah, was there a use in C2 that because they're both compatible with COM, right?

1:03:46So yes, they are both compatible with COM. However, the original proposal prior to the application submittal was for a contractor's office. So the existing zoning district is an office zoning district, but it does not permit a contractor's office. C2 permits a contractor's office. So that's how The initial conversation came to be. They were proposing a contractor's office. We said, okay, we'll consider amending to COM to allow for rezoning to C2 to give you the contractor's

1:04:17office. However, given that information taken into context of the surrounding area and the sensitivity of the site design, we would recommend to align other uses in the zone. with the character of the area and restrict uses that would not be conducive to that. So that's how it initially started. Could a

1:04:35contractor's also be a special exception in a C one? It's not a good thing.

1:04:38I know that would

1:04:39be two

1:04:40processes. No, I don't think it is at all. It is not. No.

1:04:44And are there any other contractors' offices in that section of Little Road?

1:04:48Good question.

1:04:49I'm not sure. I drive it every well, I d I was gonna say I drive it every day. I drive the eggs and my it depends which way I go home, sometimes nineteen, sometimes little road, but and I've lived there my almost my entire life. No, there aren't any. Sure.

1:05:04Sounds like that. That was the initial discussion. And kind of snowballed into why we're here now.

1:05:12Two I do have one other additional question, which is The language you have in the agenda memo. I'm assuming that's not the actual language of the D description. The reason I'm asking is because Your lib local language is not what we normally use. So it

1:05:34Is that gonna be converted to our actual live local deed restriction? 'Cause that's I don't I it it almost looks like it was intentionally written a different way. So that's why I'm asking.

1:05:45I think

1:05:45we wouldn't

1:05:45convert it.

1:05:46Yeah. So that language was recommended by our county attorney's office, but yes, we would convert it for the deed restriction.

1:05:57So the the the actual deed restriction is not going with this plan amendment.

1:06:01Correct.

1:06:01It would be going with the future rezoning.

1:06:04Correct.

1:06:04If it's going with the feature rezoning, Liam is fully aware of how to write tech condition, so I That answers my question. At least that part of my question.

1:06:14Do we have any other questions?

1:06:17No, nothing else. Okay. Thank

1:06:19you.

1:06:20Thank you. Is the applicant present?

1:06:30I'm afraid you're stuck with me again today. Thank you for your attention. Uh Cindy Terra Panny went to

1:06:35it's clear that you did read this one because you

1:06:39This one I didn't know. Well you know what happened with these two agenda items, they came on late for whatever reason through the county system. So it was a little bit of a scramble at the end, I will tell you, um, for all of us, not just me, but for the county staff too. Cindy Terrapani, I'm here on behalf of the applet applicant who is also the property owner, Castang LLC, um, and I have been sworn in. I do have um an exhibit we'll talk about in a few minutes. But I'll pass them out now.

1:07:03Move to receive and file. Second.

1:07:06Motion a second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed. Motion carries.

1:07:14I'm going to really focus my conversation on the gas station, the deed restriction, because that seems to be the really the only area that we have, so difference of opinion with the staff. As she said, I do want to hit a couple of highlights. It is a signalized intersection of two major roads, Little Road and Jasmine. It's about a mile south of 52. Although it's not technically conflict zoning according to the county's definition, clearly Res 1 and P. CO2 are not consistent zoning and plan categories, you can't do the same things in those plan categories, those two districts.

1:07:45Little Road is an arterial with six lanes. Jasmine Boulevard is an east-west collector and he runs all the way from 19 on the west to Hilltop Drive on the east. The plan amendment site was previously developed with three houses, all of which uh the um Property owner demolished. They were unfortunately being used by a homeless camp, and the property owner has also started clearing out the site, although that's gotten a little slowed down due to the storms. But now that these improvements have been made with

1:08:15the houses down and the debris starting to get cleared out, the homeless have now dispersed off of the property and hopefully that will remain. I would suggest to you that commercial development at the intersection of major streets is a major, is a very typical development pattern in Pasco County. And I have an exhibit to kind of walk you through that. My uh quarter that I looked at was a little smaller in geography than the county's uh discussion. Mine went from Uh about a two-mile corridor from State Road 52 on the north to Ridge Road on the south. And in this section of

1:08:46Little Road, commercial zoning and commercial development occurs at every major road intersection. Some are not all four corners, some are some corners, but every single intersection. The first page of the handout shows that and again I apologize with uh no electricity you're getting the old school um instead of a PowerPoint today, but I think it conveys the information. The red uh stars are where you have commercial development at the major intersections. There are six major intersections. If you turn to the second page, starting at the north at State Road

1:09:1652, you can see all of the commercial development and on the southeast quadrant of that intersection, residential development immediately adjacent to commercial. You go to the next page. The first intersection is Jasmine. That's of course where the plan amendment's located. And we have existing Walgreens at the northwest corner with C1 zoning. Going to the next intersection of Grove in the southeast quadrant, the VA complex there is adjacent to residential. I believe that's the same site you just discussed having the uh adult daycare on

1:09:46your agenda today. Fox Hollow Drive is probably a really good example, very comparable to Jasmine Boulevard. That intersection has two corners developed with commercial uses and zoning that are immediately adjacent to single-family homes. The southwest corner is occupied by Circle K Gas Station, immediately adjacent to single family homes. And the road along the south there, Fox Hollow Drive, runs along the side of the gas station. It continues west into the residential neighborhood, very similar as

1:10:16you would have at the Jasmine Avenue, Jasmine Boulevard location. The northwest corner is also adjacent to residential, it's zone C two, but it's currently vacant. If you go to page four, the next intersection is Embassy Boulevard or Hilltop Drive. This intersection has three corners with commercial uses adjacent to residential. The northeast corner is occupied by 7 Eleven next to single family, and again, Hilltop Drive runs along the south side of those commercial, continues east into

1:10:46the residential neighborhood. Same situation at the southeast corner. Which is occupied by Walgreens adjacent to single family zoning. Yeah, also continue on also located on Hilltop Drive. The third corner, the northwest corner, is occupied by mobile gas station and an eye care center, again adjacent to single-family development. Embassy Boulevard on this case continues past that commercial and into the residential neighborhood, similar to the Plan Amendment site that we're talking about today. And the fifth page.

1:11:18Ridge Road and that shows you all the commercial development activity at Ridge at Ridge Road. So this is all to summarize.

1:11:28That all of the intersections of of major roads with Little Road in this two-mile corridor have commercial zoning and are developed with commercial uses. Additionally, these commercial uses and gas stations are immediately adjacent to residential uses at five intersections that we've talked about. Uh excuse me, the commercial uses are immediately adjacent to residential at five intersections. Of those five, two of those intersections are developed with gas stations. So I didn't misspeak.

1:11:55Can I ask you a question?

1:11:56Sure.

1:11:57So

1:12:00In my experience, gas stations are a little more intense about access management. use than a contractor's office. So W would your access be off of Little Road or Jasmine? That's the first question. Or both. Or both. And then the follow-up question is can you gain access to either one or both of those roads with instill Comply with our access spacing requirements.

1:12:30Uh to answer the first well to answer generally we have not done a site plan um to determine ex and we haven't sent that through the county so we don't know what access will be approved. We hope to have access, one access point on each road. I did measure the Jasmine one. I think it's tight, but I think it probably could survive, you know, probably could meet the requirements there to have one driveway on Jasmine and one driveway on Little. That's obviously why gas stations like to be at a corner because they want to have access to get in and out easily

1:13:00and conveniently, as do other commercial uses. That's not the only commercial business that likes to be located at a corner. Um I will say too, there is absolutely no reason For anyone who uh stops at the gas station could to continue east on Jasmine, unless they live in that neighborhood. There's no commercial down there. It does connect to Hilltop and Hilltop does continue north and south. But if you are going to go north or south, you're gonna go back to the light and turn north or south on a little right. Excuse me.

1:13:29You could go to uh to Oceola. Mm.

1:13:32Yes.

1:13:33Perhaps.

1:13:33Oh I do.

1:13:34But I I'm what I'm saying is I think that most travelers, unless they live in the neighborhood, are not going to turn east and go into the neighborhood. Um

1:13:43So I guess I'd like our transportation staff to comment on that. I mean, is

1:13:49Since that's the use apparently at issue, I'd like to know whether that use can work from an access management standpoint.

1:14:02It be I'm only pointing out because the contractor's office likely could be just fine with a single access point, very low trip generator. You know, It's probably three trips a day in a contractor's office. Uh gas station has Far more than that. So I guess I need to know from our transportation staff whether that's going to cause issues from a access management spacing Standpoint.

1:14:31Is there somebody that can answer that?

1:14:39Is Essen still on? No.

1:14:43No, he's he's not on any longer. We do have uh one person with transportation.

1:14:59Is there anyone who can speak to access management at the at this location on the northeast corner of Little Road and Jasmine Boulevard?

1:15:16Mm. What's the depth of this parcel on Jasmine?

1:15:21Um just a second I can tell you.

1:15:34So will it. code we have isolated corner parcel clearances. I have to clean up.

1:15:49Should I continue or do we want waiting for someone?

1:15:54Well do we have anybody? I don't uh does it

1:15:57sound like anybody's there that wants to address this?

1:16:00We're waiting for someone to jump back on to the meeting.

1:16:08Do you want to come back to that?

1:16:11Maybe and then additionally, just to let you know, we do have two people who have signed up to speak on this matter. Okay. So

1:16:19Yeah, I you can let the applicant finish the presentation. I just need staff to answer the question at some point.

1:16:23We'll come back for the transportation.

1:16:25Yeah, and I I want to address this contractor's office. My client never It that was really never a an issue that a use that he was considering, so I don't know why that is a a problem. We've already agreed to have that one to be one of the prohibited uses. So that's really, you know, it's not a an issue. I think there was someone else looking at the property before my client purchased it. Maybe that was the use they were intending, but

1:16:47is well is a gas station allowed in C one? Or no.

1:16:52A gas station is not a permitted use in C One. It is a special exception.

1:16:55So the gas station was the use that you were trying to get here.

1:16:58There's a my client is a developer. He's not the end user. At the time that we agreed to uh to to put gas station on with the other 16 prohibited uses that we've already agreed to, um, it was frankly to move the agenda along. We couldn't get the case on a public hearing. Um and number two. he hadn't got any interest yet from gas stations, so we thought, Well Let's see if we can get the case moved along. We'll see what happens. Just in the last three weeks, a little bit before the storms uh started happening, there has been interest in gas,

1:17:29there's been interest in other retail users, there's been interest by other restaurants. Sit down You know, things like a Panera or a you know a sit-down bottle.

1:17:39So the the only C2 use

1:17:43That you're seeking, potentially wanting is gas station.

1:17:46Well I'm not sure if the if a bank drive-thru is allowed. The drive-thru portion, I'm not sure. Allowed, yes. That's allowed.

1:17:54Also allowed, yes. Well that's something we can certainly look at as the C one versus the C two. Um we have we're not here today on a zoning, obviously. We're here today with a plan amendment.

1:18:03But what I'm hearing stuff say is the gas station is not allowed. So but still back to the gas station issue is what we're talking about.

1:18:09Well the reason No, what we're talking about today is a plan amendment. Y'all are trying to make a decision on a plan amendment. The staff is saying they're only going to recommend approval if we agree to prohibit a gas station. We don't have an end user yet, so we don't we feel very uncomfortable limiting that use when we don't know for sure. That may be the use that does take the site with an maybe another small restaurant user. We don't know. But at this point, for us to say no to a gas station, then we will agree to prohibit. pivot it does seem to be a problem, you know, for my client to do that. So

1:18:39that's why we're here.

1:18:40I'm only pointing out that if staff They didn't have to go this route. They could have just said We're only recommending approval C one.

1:18:48but we're not talking about a zoning today we're talking about i

1:18:51understand that i understand that but it this sort of got to us a little backwards i mean Because You've made it very clear you want C2 and staff doesn't that's why we have this list of prohibited uses in this. agenda memo is bec is because there was an assumption you were gonna apply for C two. If

1:19:10that's true.

1:19:11If there's an assumption you're gonna apply for C one. I don't even know if there's an issue. I mean the because sounds like nobody's well, we haven't heard from the public yet. But I mean

1:19:22we could cross that bridge when we get to. I

1:19:25I have another another question.

1:19:27Yeah, we'll

1:19:27we'll get to you. The demolition on this site was done A couple of months ago.

1:19:34Hello.

1:19:36That was about

1:19:37right.

1:19:38Yes.

1:19:39When are we getting rid of the foundations? Uh hopefully this week. I mean they've been sitting out there For a couple months now.

1:19:47Correct. The

1:19:47initial

1:19:48Sor We just g you gotta come up to the podium if

1:19:50you're gonna speak. And have you been sworn, sir?

1:19:53Yeah. Good afternoon. My name is Doug Casting. I'm the owner of the lot. I have been sworn in. Um my address is [address removed]. Okay. Um Okay. What

1:20:07was your question yet, sir? It was about the foundations. They've been sitting out there on the I mean we so I saw the buildings go down and the sites got Debris all over the place, the foundations, the building, concrete debris all over the place. It looks like a mess.

1:20:21Yes, sir.

1:20:22It is.

1:20:22Um It was supposed to be cleaned up before the storms. Our original contractor who was doing the demo work went to jail. um with a lot of my money. And so we've been scrambling to get somebody. We have somebody under contract, the same person that's actually been clearing the lot. If you're familiar with the lot, it was quite blight, it was quite overgrown. We've cleared out that part. You're you're absolutely correct that there are still construction materials there. I'm hoping. By the end of this weekend, all that

1:20:53will be cleared up. I will say on that issue that

1:20:57the county's having difficulty getting a little bit of a little bit of a little

1:20:59I understand that, but we're we're in a state of emergen this happened a couple of months ago. This has been sitting there like that.

1:21:05But that's reasonable.

1:21:07Explanation.

1:21:08I'm just saying that if he thinks this is gonna get done in the next week, I'm not sure that's an accurate assumption. Well, I tend to agree with you,

1:21:14Bruce. I understand the situation. And then also, if if I could just mention, so C2, one of the reasons that we wanted C2 was for grocery stores. Um, this lot fits the buy box for niche upper scale type grocery stores like Aldi. Um we tried Trader Joe's, they weren't in our Interested. But that was one of the primary reasons we wanted C2 as well. So we could shop it around to those. Smaller groceries. Is Denise, is that allowed

1:21:40in C

1:21:40One? Yes. Yes, that's allowed in C One.

1:21:42And how far is it up to from here to fifty two?

1:21:46About a mile.

1:21:47So you think Aldi would go with a mile separation?

1:21:50No, I was just saying it fit the buy box. And so we sometimes use that as something like Aldi. If it if an Aldi will fit in there, you know, sometimes we can It's someone else.

1:22:00Is

1:22:00a

1:22:00convenience store without gas allowed in C one?

1:22:03Yes.

1:22:03Yes. So it's the gas pumps that converted to C2.

1:22:06That's that's correct. Or special exception in C one. It would be a special exception in C one and by virtue of it being a special exception in C one, it's a permitted use in C.

1:22:15But I'm wondering if this is all solved by just rezoning it to C one and then if he decides if a gas station comes along, then we can decide that by a special exception. I agree.

1:22:24I I think we we hear you. We definitely will consider that. And we're not, like I said, we're not to the point yet of doing the rezoning, but that's why we're here in our very first step. We didn't run the rezoning and the plan amendment together. We're here trying to do this part first. We didn't really honestly didn't think there would be such a huge objection to gas station. We didn't understand it. Um because the same amount of traffic is a very good thing.

1:22:48Commercial development on that side of Little Road for the past thirty years.

1:22:53Well, I'm sorry, I didn't know that history, Mr. Moody. I

1:22:56apologize. I mean, this this parcel has been on the market for many, many years. In fact, I've had several clients that were interested in this parcel and were chased away from any commercial land use or zoning. So I I mean, I'm really quite surprised that this is even here, period. Well I we haven't gotten there yet.

1:23:15And I'm just trying to narrow down what the request is. Because I understand it's the plan stage. Okay. But we have an agenda memo in front of us that it has all these lists of prohibited C2 uses, which kind of implies that you're seeking C two, okay? Otherwise that wouldn't be in there. So If I'm not saying that even C I don't know whether even C one's appropriate. I'm just wanna make sure we're that When the public gets up here and the Planning Commissioner's considering this Understand the Plan Amendment stage. But I think

1:23:46everybody's gonna want to know what is the ultimate request going to be on the zoning side. Is it gonna be C1, which has a very different list of uses than C2? And so what I'm hearing Denise say is that even if it was C one You could, and you did say a gas station. I'm not saying it should be approved, but it's accept you could do a separate request for that as a special exception.

1:24:09So you don't want to do contractor's office?

1:24:11Right.

1:24:13The grocery store I'm hearing is allowed in C one, restaurants are allowed in C one I don't know what else was on your own.

1:24:21Based on the staff memo,

1:24:22I'd probably be pretty scared because it says the existing employment generating potential for this project would be increased from a point five floor area ratio, which I'm not sure that's true in res one. To a three point zero far.

1:24:37Clearly no b nobody ever builds to that kind of an F A R so

1:24:41Yeah, but that's the justification we're giving to approve it.

1:24:47I I don't think they could get that with C and still meet C one standards, but I guess we're not thinking that either, but If I was a member of the public I'd be a little nervous.

1:24:55Would it be appropriate if I finish my presentation and then I'm happy to answer any more questions you all have? And then, of course, I'd like to reserve some time for rebuttal if you don't mind, because I sure we obviously have some full speech. I hear you about the C one versus C2. I think we were a little, just to summarize, we were a little unclear about some of the C2, some of the uses that my client desired. We didn't think we're allowed in C one. We're hearing that now that most of those are, except for gas. So we will take that back. We'll take it under consideration. Yeah. I I can't I don't think we're gonna make a decision for you today, but we we hear you, we hear your concerns. I just want

1:25:25to say again, the staff has agreed that commercial is right along Little Road. They've said that the COM Land Development Code, this is a quote from the staff report, is appropriate at this location pursuant to the various policies flu 1.6.2, and it meets the location criteria, meaning it's at the intersection of two major roads, Little and Jasmine. We have already agreed to honestly to get to the deed restriction part. We really thought the deed restriction discussion should appropriately happen at the rezoning stage. I've done other rezoning

1:25:55that did have deed restrictions, so I'm fully aware how that works and how it's been requested and how it works through the process. So I was a little surprised that it was a conversation at this point. But regardless, we have already agreed to 16 prohibited uses off of the uh to include in the deed restrictions, including the live local, because we do not intend to do residential on the property. The only one that's left now that we we're talking about is d is gas. We merely ask to be treated the same as other intersections of commercial properties along

1:26:25Little Road. And we think that we would respectfully request your recommendation of approval of the plan amendment without this discussion about the gas station and reserve that conversation to the rezoning and the deed restriction stage. Well, you all will see it again and we'll make that decision in a noticed public hearing. I do thank you for the opportunity to speak with you today, and I'll be happy to answer any questions. And of course, would like a few minutes at the end for any rebuttal as necessary.

1:26:51Okay. Thank you. Um is somebody from transportation on the transportation question.

1:27:02Who's there? Stacy, are you

1:27:06are you there? Uh hey, uh good afternoon. This is Asan. Um Mr. Girardi, what was the question?

1:27:14I couldn't restate it. Yeah,

1:27:15David will restate the question.

1:27:16So the discussion, Essen, is that We're evaluating whether a gas station is appropriate at the northeast corner of Jasmine and Little Road. It the site is shown on our graphic. I don't know if you can see it. Um,

1:27:36Can we Can they get access to Little Road? And or Jasmine and still meet our spacing requirements from an access management standpoint.

1:27:50So spacing requirement I believe on Little Road would be um I'll have to check the table, but For an ar it's an arterial roadway, so I believe will be four hundred and forty Unless the speed is above forty five miles per hour. Jasmine would also be at Um four forty, if I'm not mistaken, I can pull up the table, but For for a gas station use, it and this is purely my opinion, if you look at the westbound

1:28:20approach. Um to northbound, you see that there is a merge lane that's there on Dell Road. And the geometry for the westbound right turn lane to go northbound. is separated at that intersection. There I believe there the intersection approach design will have to be amended to address a connection to Jasmine Teleport.

1:28:51uh etcetera or if the axis is off of little road, even if uh we think about a variation of uh an alternative standard That whole merge lane issue has to be addressed. That would be uh I think problematic because people who are merging to go northbound. are clearing their left side or the and they're not looking at what traffic w may may or may not be coming out of a potential gas station site likeways there. It can create a a major conflict point there. But

1:29:22I in my opinion that westbound approach to northbound, that that intersection doesn't really have to be modified.

1:29:34Mm-hmm, a gas station in that location. Gas stations do draw seventy percent, about sixty, seventy percent is all passer by traffic. So a lot of right in, right out movements happen at gas stations. That's why I'm saying it may be creating a lot of safety contracts at this both the locations. Uh I think if one was to be fixed out of the two it would Probably makes sense to have it at The lesser of the functionally classified roadway which is Jasmine, it's a collector. Little

1:30:04as an Ontario. Um I don't know if Stacy is online, if she's got the table pulled up, but I can if you just give me one second. And I'll tell you what the spacing stain that needs is.

1:30:16Yes, I have the table called a bit slowly. For Little Rogue or I'm sorry for Jasmine Road at 30 miles per hour. It's a collector. So it's going to be the two forty five. And it's for a little road which is going to be at a speed of forty five miles per hour. And it is an ulterior roadway. Let's hold that one.

1:30:41Sorry. Yeah. That would be four hundred forty feet. Yes, correct.

1:30:49And so does anybody know the depth, I mean the the width of the site on

1:30:53Yes. So a little uh excuse me. Um Jasmine Boulevard is 253 feet in length along Jasmine. The site is 250 feet, three feet along Jasmine, so at a 245 beat tight, we'll be at the far eastern end. And Little Road is approximately 460 feet running north and south along the property line. Um so again the driveway at that 440 feet would be at the very northern end of the driveway. There is a There is an Axel Lane northbound on Little Today.

1:31:24So obviously that would be reviewed whether it's long enough as part of the site plan review process.

1:31:31If you go to nine oh one three J. This is a An isolated corner property. which doesn't meet the minimum spacing standards, so there's an alternative for these With smaller spacing standards.

1:31:50I don't know if I don't know if isolated corner applies when you've got two access points, but I maybe it's So if they I think if they have access to off a little They're not considered an isolated coroner.

1:32:07Yeah. If it is at the northern end of the property, it's at the very end of that uh Excel lane. There, so It seems like it'd be plausible that could be

1:32:18Addressed. I guess that's a good idea.

1:32:27The gas station here, there's a potential way that it could work. So that answers my question. Okay.

1:32:32Just to be clear, if I'm understanding them correctly, these spacing standards would apply to any commercial development, not just a gas station. Right? Those

1:32:40are true statement, but but my point is that a gas station As Mr. Khalil said, is a very intense use from an access man. There's a lot it generates a lot of dryway trips. Yes. So That was why I asked the question.

1:32:57Good. Okay. Anything else for Cindy? So I think there are a couple of people here from the public that wanna speak and then Cindy will have you back up for rebuttal.

1:33:05Mr. Chair, the per first person that signed up to speak is Joni Wilson.

1:33:18Good afternoon. My name is Joni Wilson. I live a couple doors down at [address removed]. Um I appreciate the time to speak and I was sworn in. Um I just want to go over a couple points. My big issue was the gas station or any high traffic business in the area. Jasmine Boulevard and Little Road have a ton of accidents for such a small resid I mean, I know you guys consider it a major roadway for Jasmine, but it's residential. There's not businesses on that road. Um

1:33:49Just a Google search, I found 10 gas stations within 2.5 miles of that site. the closest being less than a mile away. I think I know you guys are local, so Griffin Park is not far away. That is a High drug use area, drug sales. We get transients. I'm glad the buildings are down, even if they are rubble. I'm thankful for that. But Even with those buildings there, we had people in the lot across the street setting fires. Um the fire department was

1:34:19out recently. I feel like it could bring more crime to the area. It's just a nuisance area drawing attention to a gas station. I mean, it's walking distance from that. There's plenty of other gas stations around that you can get to easily. Um environmentally, a lot of the residents immediately around that area have Pets, agricultural kind of land. The immediate neighbor there has a bunch of dogs. I think they have chickens. I

1:34:49talked to at least four other neighbors who couldn't be here who are all very concerned about having a high traffic business at that intersection. Um, I know personally I am not opposed to a commercial business being there. Um it's a little road. I mean it's only practical for it to be commercial use. But I just see like I know they talked about not having resident or you know, people other than residents using Jasmine Boulevard, but we do have people other than residents cutting through there. Um Osceola, Miniola,

1:35:20Bass Lake, Hilltop, people cut through those areas. Hilltop had even tried um having Yeah, speed bumps installed. Um which I hate speed bumps, but I get why they wanted that because we have There's kids out there in the dark in the morning for bus stops. Um I noticed that I just feel like with so many gas stations in the area, there's not really a need. Um I saw recently that 7-Eleven's closing 3% of their gas stations due to decreased sales.

1:35:51We're pushing all the electric vehicles. So I feel like there's going to be less and less need for that, and it's going to draw the wrong types of people to that area. Right next door, or I guess one property over, is a charter school that is, I know, I think elementary and middle school. Um they also have a car line that operates, you know, twice a day that I think they extended the turn lane to accommodate their car line. So it just brings more traffic to that corner, that intersection.

1:36:21A lot of people are doing U-turns now to get to the school in the mornings and in the afternoons. Um

1:36:31Is that my timer?

1:36:32Yeah,

1:36:32that's your time.

1:36:33Please go ahead and just wrap it up. It's fine.

1:36:34Um so I mean I just I know a lot of the residents feel the same way and I totally condone other uses, even like a sit-down restaurant, but anything high traffic like that is only going to cause more car accidents and probably the wrong especially a 24-hour business, the wrong kind of people to be loitering in the area.

1:36:52Okay. Very good.

1:36:53Thank you.

1:36:54Thank you.

1:36:56Mr.

1:36:56Chair, the next person is Alan Rose.

1:37:04Good afternoon. My name is Alan Rose, [address removed]. Yes, I have Miss Warning. And I have been communicating with zoning and with uh with all of the objections and the restrictions that apply to this parcel. Uh it's uh Brian Yunker has had all these. So you should have all of these objections. What it is is this property is part of Golden Acres, Unit One. And it sh it was I don't know when the last zoning change happened,

1:37:34but this zoning change, I'm here and I'm objecting to it. It is a little bit more than a little bit. Uh We have a number of things, impaired waters. It it it's drainage swell from this property will affect Bear Creek. Bear Creek overflows at every heavy rain down to Osceola where Bear Creek goes under. You see that flooding, especially with during these last hurricanes, you saw it again. It will it is also uh bat certain mineral restrictions on these. There's not supposed to be any commission.

1:38:05commercial building on this type of restrictions and that's what this one restricted waters basin. That's one. From where this property is. eastbound to Hill Town. Well I live All those homes there, $400,000 to $1 million. Do you think we want? And I just, I just rebuilt my home. My taxes went from $1,500 to over $6,000. And now you're gonna bring a commercial development. And my property, I'm gonna lose money. I'm gonna have a serious devaluation

1:38:35of my property if you put a commercial property up there like a gas station. uh I'm talking in the neighborhood, I would see two hundred thousand dollars off what I would expect. My neighbor's gonna put his property up for over seven hundred thousand. he can expect the same thing to happen to him. this type of within Golden Acres, and this is part of Golden Acres, and it does not have access to Little Road at this time. It it only has access On Jasmine. And yes, it will definitely impede that turning lane. Uh uh there's

1:39:06so much. So much. You should have it all. Um I I commit I submitted pictures to show on Jasmine if you go up There's there's pictures of time. So you get another minute. But there's pictures of all this. If you look up Jasmine from this line, you see nothing but oak trees. People think it's just a beautiful, nice tree-lined community. Well behind all of those oak trees, what people don't see. Our states. Residential estates. And they are beautiful home sites. A lot of most of them are

1:39:36gonna be equestrian. And most of them are gonna be resident they're all residential. And it's a beautiful neighborhood. That's why I moved there. That's why I invested in this my property. You put something like this, And I'm gonna start really raising kids because my taxes, I'm gonna need you, hey, instead of 6,000 now, let's bring it back down to 2,000. And I assure you, I will raise Kane. This should not happen in our neighborhood. That's Golden Acres Unit One. Thank you.

1:40:04Thank you.

1:40:08Good Denise, is there anybody else signed up?

1:40:10That's the last person I had signed up to speak. If you want to check to see if there's anybody

1:40:14else. Is there anybody else uh here to speak on this item? And there's nobody on WebEx. There's no one on WebEx. Very good. Cindy, do you want to come back up?

1:40:27Sure. Love to come back. I'll be very brief because I think we've been talking about this quite a lot. Um first of all, we're asking for the comprehensive plan category. We're asking to do commercial. We will we have heard you about what you've cons heard. We've heard the neighbors about their concerns about gas station. We will look seriously at that and and um try to come back with something that we think you would be in agreement with. With regard to the capacity on Little Road, which I know we talked a lot about access driveways, there are currently driveways on the site that served

1:40:57residential. We will work something out with the county staff if we are allowed to move forward through the rezoning and the site plan process. We will work out whatever the county requires with regard to the access points. Um But with regard to to the volume on Little Road, I just wanted to point out that this county did the transportation needs assessment for this plan amendment. We didn't do it. We actually asked the county to do it. And they found that there was capacity on Little Road till the year 2045, with including uh this site as a commercial site. So I don't think

1:41:27the Little Road capacity is an issue. I do understand that where the driveways go and how they affect um The the particular use and the access to the property and safe access. I understand that totally, but we can't get to that point unless you agree that commercial is the right place. The staff has said commercial is the right at this corner. I've showed you an exhibit of um six other intersections along Little that all have commercial. We're asking to be treated the same way and allow us to move forward with the plan amendment. Come back with the rezoning with the appropriate

1:41:57deed restrictions with hopefully hopefully the C1 zoning district, and then go through the site plan process. Thank you very much for your time. And again, I'm happy to answer any further questions.

1:42:11I'll just make a comment. Um yeah, just general comments, not a question. So I I I live on Lakeview. I drive through here every you know, every day pretty much. Um I I think the you know we're talking about a plan amendment today. Um I think we can get into the details of all of the what type of commercial use would be good when it comes to the the zoning portion of it, which is what kind of confused me why there was so many of these deed restrictions that were on here. uh at this at this stage. Um but

1:42:41I think commercial makes sense on that corner. I'm like I said, I live in that neighborhood. Uh we know that residential probably doesn't make sense on a six-lane highway. Uh on that. And so um, matter of fact, the young lady testified up here just a second ago, she'd be the one probably most affected. uh you being two doors down from that and um I don't think we heard from the homeowner that was actually right next door, but you know So there are a lot If they had concerns, obviously that can be addressed at that point with buffering

1:43:11and things like that. But I think commercial at this stage makes sense. Um and I say that as a resident of that neighborhood on Lake View.

1:43:20So Question for staff.

1:43:25Right now the property's P O two.

1:43:28With a res one flu.

1:43:32That's in theory a conflict zoning can they develop under the PO two standard today?

1:43:40Mr. Chairman Mariano. The Dictar Espito's playing development economic growth. The PO two zoning classification is consistent with the Res One future land use classification per policy flu one six five. Okay. Yeah. So so they're they're entitled to the full range of PO two uses. The All right. So

1:44:01Reserved.

1:44:04And Derek and then not I get ya. I don't think the site Is suitable for residential development. There was a time when this was Plaza Drive. When Golden Acres was first developed, yes, these were residential sites. when the county opted to extend Little Road north to fifty two and make it a six lane road. Who'd want to live there? I get that. But there is opportunity for development. This is still zoned PO

1:44:35two. They can have professional offices there, they can have business services, financial services. public and semi public buildings, post office, police fire stations, libraries, museums, personal services like beauty and barbershops, tailor shops, laundry shops, shoe repair, dry cleaners, florists, photographic studios, veterinary clinics. There's other things

1:45:02That they were they can get some commercial use and income from the site without taking it to the

1:45:10C two. level in the future or the the comm classification. Of the right-of-way. of commercial development. And Although I hear the applicants say they want to be treated the same. I'm looking at the map and I'm looking at Jasmine and I'm looking at Grove and the vast majority of the These are P O

1:45:35So they do fit with the rest of what's going on there. And even though at Fox Hollows. There is some C2 on the west side of Little Road. I would tell you that the owner of the one at the n northwest corner of Fox Hollow and Little Road has been trying to develop that for twenty five years that I know of and the problem is the site's so small it's There's nothing you can fit on that C one use and the circle K that's

1:46:05on the southwest corner is so small it's basically dysfunctional.

1:46:12It's not a great gas station site.

1:46:16Yeah

1:46:18the people that live in Golden Golden acres. Live in an estate residential Zoning district.

1:46:29All right. They do have nice homes. They have nice properties.

1:46:34It's not unusual to see someone riding a horse. It's not an appropriate location for gas stations and high intensity commercial uses. The office uses and that's what you've seen. I think there's like she said, you mentioned an eye care place. I know that's been there forever and a day. Those things all seem there's been insurance up and down there. Those things are kind of fine. Fairly low traffic generators. But high high traffic generators? I'm

1:47:05just not sure that's the right place. But I agree it's not a residential site. That makes no sense. Unfortunately the site's not big enough to be an M P U D. And I'd almost wish it could come back as an MPUD because my bigger concern is for the lot that's immediately to the east of this parcel. So if he were to get a C one or a C two zoning, he's gonna end up with a 30-foot setback for a building. adjacent to residential, agree?

1:47:36Agreed.

1:47:37But that doesn't mean he won't have a parking lot right up to his rear property line minus the Landscape buffer. Right. So if this guy were to get an Aldi here or some other competing grocery store. He could potentially have a loading bay next to his house, a parking lot. all the boxes and the generators that go behind grocery stores. So I'm not sure that's the right location

1:48:07for that.

1:48:11So I just meant to make one more comment. Um It's obvious it's the Planning Commission about what you do with the request, but In the agenda memo under the planning discussion number two, it talks about some access points. It says there's an access to Little Road from three that's 395 feet from Little Road. And there's three accesses to the site from Jasmine. Those were for houses that got torn down. We just heard testimony from Essen that those would not comply with our land development code. So I do not think you should be putting in

1:48:41your agenda memo. access points that would that would be inconsistent with our land development code. So Either strike it. Or say that those access points would have to be removed if it's converted to a commercial use or something, but you can't just leave a statement that as if those access points would be appropriate. that this is a commercial use.

1:49:05I'm not even sure they'd be appropriate if it is for an office use.

1:49:11Okay.

1:49:16guarantee you that S will not allow three curb cuts on on Jasmine.

1:49:27Okay.

1:49:29Anything else from up here?

1:49:31And my only other comment is if If I don't know what Planning Commissioner's gonna do on the commercial Request, but if If you are uncomfortable with C two You probably would need to direct staff to remove all that language about with the deed restriction with the C2 uses because if that's gonna be a deferred issue, it should there should not be any language in the agenda memo. that implies that it's going to be C two if you're going to defer that issue.

1:49:58Yeah, that's kind of where I'm at.

1:49:59But but C1. It's what you you only decide what you want to do with the request to com because that's the real issue before you. I'm

1:50:06just not comfortable with the COM and I see that the property can still be developed with some lower intensity commercial development as it is today. So it

1:50:19Which doesn't necessarily need to be residential. So they can still do offices and that kind of thing.

1:50:32Anybody else?

1:50:37Yeah, I mean I I'm with John. I'm I'm not comfortable with the cum. land use in in proximity of the estate residential there.

1:50:46Sorry. Is there a motion anybody wants to make?

1:50:52I've made enough

1:50:53motions today.

1:50:56I'll make the motion to recommend denial of the proposed comprehensive plan amendment.

1:51:03Motion on the floor is our second.

1:51:11I

1:51:11guess the motion fails.

1:51:12This motion fails. Is there another motion?

1:51:15Just to be clear, the chair, you can second the I can

1:51:17second.

1:51:17You can if you want to. It's up to you. I'm only saying that because you just stated your position.

1:51:25Let me take that back. I will second the motion. Okay. Okay. So motion and a second. Any other discussion? All in favor? Aye? Aye. Opposed? Nay. That's why I didn't know.

1:51:38Can we clarify for me?

1:51:42Roll call.

1:51:47Yeah, just to be clear, an I means you're supporting denial. Denial,

1:51:50correct. Okay,

1:51:50that's right.

1:51:52Christopher Cool?

1:51:53Next.

1:51:55Summary?

1:52:02Derek

1:52:03Pollis? Chris Williams?

1:52:06Nine.

1:52:08Jamie uh Vice Chairman Jamie Jury.

1:52:11Hi.

1:52:15Okay.

1:52:16All right. So new motion on the floor.

1:52:18All right, I'll make a motion to approve the comp plan amendment to com, but I I um so um let me pause myself for a second there. So what you were discussing, David, about all of the language regarding The C two stuff. Right. So all the the restrictions uh Regarding C T 'cause I I I I still don't understand why that's in this application because this is just a comp plan amendment. I don't

1:52:48think it needs to be in this application. I

1:52:52My concern with leaving it in Is it it presumes that C2 is an acceptable use if all of these uses were removed? And I am Heard conclusive evidence today that C two is the appropriate uh zoning for this site. It may be C one and even The applicant said they may apply for C one. So Right. Okay.

1:53:17That's kind of where I sit. I I f I feel like C you know, if it was this was approved, C one would be more appropriate than C two. So um, you know, so Can we strike that language altogether and I think

1:53:31you can make a recommendation that any language references to C2 be struck from the agenda memo as part of your motion? I but I I would also ask you that you also add your motion that the language related to the existing access points on Little Road and Jasmine also be struck from the memo as well. If you're gonna make a motion to strike stuff.

1:53:52Okay. So that's that's the motion I'll make is to approve with striking uh references, as David stated, references to the C2 uh zoning as well as uh references to the access points.

1:54:07Yeah. Agree completely with that. I think it's yeah, w this is not the appropriate time to kind of debate this this issue. It's it's its owning, so I agree with the comm.

1:54:16Okay. There's a motion and a second. Any other discussion? All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed? Nay. motion.

1:54:28We got it. We got it. Motion carries.

1:54:37Okay.

1:54:40Denise, I think that's it, correct?

1:54:42That was it, but I need a clarification. David, on this one, does Chris vote on vote on this? I was gonna ask that

1:54:49question, but it's a

1:54:49complemented compartial

1:54:52Um

1:54:52no I understand but it does kinda change it does change

1:54:54the county does not. So if he did I don't I didn't hear whether he did or didn't

1:54:58I did because I always look at it if it 'cause it

1:55:01does change density. Yeah, but you're supposed to vote if it's increasing residential density. Okay.

1:55:07Gotcha.

1:55:08This is this is decreasing. And the fact that it has a live local restriction means there's no way that it could increase resolution under so I think in that scenario Mm-hmm. Not blaming you, but it doesn't affect the result of the vote anyway. So

1:55:22Thank you.