R97B Clerk Circuit Court budget and information technology funding

1:21:40We have um P one thirteen.

1:21:42Yeah.

1:21:43Two one thirteen.

1:21:46What not?

1:21:48Make it a lunch, maybe.

1:21:52Um You're

1:21:53okay. You're okay. I'm

1:21:54trying to get ahead of myself.

1:21:55I caught myself on that myself.

1:22:00R97B? I'm gonna um present from

1:22:04the Yeah, I would think so.

1:22:32Good afternoon, Nikki Albert Soles, Pasco County Clerk Circuit Court and County Controller. Um d do the board members have the presentation and the handouts? If not, I need copies. Yes, we will give

1:22:44them to

1:22:46Need them but

1:22:48Uh

1:22:51Okay. It won't be any background. It was a second.

1:22:57Nikki, the the PowerPoint is on all their screens.

1:23:01Yes, and then there was uh two um two handouts, one handout had multiple attachments, so we'll make sure everybody has that.

1:23:07Uh

1:23:07but yes, it is the presentation series.

1:23:13Uh,

1:23:15thank you.

1:23:18Thank you.

1:23:21Right, so I'll go ahead. Well thank you, Mr. Chairman and County Commissioners. Today I'm here to present and discuss the budget submitted by my office for County Fiscal Year 2122. As you listen to what I share with you, please keep in mind that I have exhausted every avenues to convey the county's legal obligation to adequately fund my office under Florida law. I respect each of my fellow elected officials and feel strongly that you are my allies at a local level. I

1:23:51believe you fully understand and appreciate the need to provide excellent, not mediocre, services to our citizens, attract and retain a highly competent and skilled workforce, and prioritize the long-range plan for Pasco County's growth. There is not a reason Pasco can't achieve Premier County status, but we will only be successful by doing that if all the leaders and decision makers are on the side. same page. We are all partners and we are in this together, so I'm asking for your help. In

1:24:22the past two years, we have deviated from the well-established practices in how the budget process works in PASCO. Last year, due to COVID-19, the board did not hold its annual budget workshop. This workshop was traditionally conducted each year around June by the county commissions, by the county commissioners to discuss important budget topics for the next fiscal year. Constitutional officers were invited to attend the budget workshops. to present their budget request if their request was outside of the ordinary. We all know last year was exceptional

1:24:53and I acknowledge that we are still adapting to challenging circumstances, but I do not understand why the workshop was skipped entirely this year, nor was I offered an opportunity to present my budget request. Since this past June, I have expressed my concern over how my budget request is being treated. I was deeply disappointed by the lack of transparency in the budget process. I was not informed what was being submitted for my office's budget until August 26th after requesting information from this board. What's worse is

1:25:23standing here today in the second week of the 12th month of the fiscal year, with this as my only real opportunity to review my budget request with you all. During a Board of County Commissioners. As an elected official who resides over highly critical functions in our county, I find it unacceptable. Therefore, I recommend commissioners provide a forum for constitutional officers to present their budget requests if needed. Moving away from this overarching concern, I would like to focus more specifically on my

1:25:53office's situation. Year after year, my office has demonstrated fiscal responsibility by cutting positions while implementing new technologies and efficiencies. Throughout the pandemic, my office held 10% of our positions frozen, suspended overtime in travel, reduced supplies, and postponed important projects. Put simply, funding was and still is insufficient to cover the cost provided require providing required services that Governor DeSantis himself declared essential. From the highest elected authority in the state, the word came down. The

1:26:24clerk's office, as a component of public safety and human services, must continue to do what it is assigned to do. For that reason, we never shut our doors. We never curtailed our operating hours. We massed up, sanitized, socially distanced, installed barriers met remotely, and continued providing essential and timely services to our community. That said, we are grateful the county shared some of its CARES funding to help my office through those difficult times. However, to continue to fulfill our constitutional statutory and court duties, my

1:26:54office must be appropriately funded going forward. The support for the increase of my office's budget is provided for in Florida law and is the result of a thorough review and examination. Of the laws and that prescribe how clerks' offices in non-charter counties like Pasco are funded. This in no way reads a reflection of the previous clerks who have occupied this office. I hold their service to Pasco County in the highest esteem. They did an admirable job of coping with massive legislative changes and technological

1:27:24demands impacting the clerk's office. However, current circumstances require a review of the laws that determine our funding. Our analysis identified the underlying causes as to why my office is facing an interruption in its ability to accomplish critical, statutorily mandated operations for our community. The Board of County Commissioners and many other stakeholders. Local requirements, factors, and circumstances beyond the control of my office continue to impact workload and resource needs. Since 2010, Pasco's

1:27:55population increased 19%, and the county increased staffing by 39% to provide additional services. This is the expected direction, the direct relationship between service demand and staffing. However, in that same time frame, the clerk's office cut 11% of its positions due to funding shortages while our workload increased. This funding situation is unsustainable and is worsening. I'm here to explain the funding model and ask you to do your part.

1:28:27County Administrator has advised me to ask the state for additional funding. I, as an attorney, believe wholeheartedly in the letter of the law, and the law does not require the state to pay for these expenses. It's the county's responsibility. More than that, I believe Pasco's rapidly growing population deserves our very best. My office's ability to serve well into the future is at stake. I will explain my budget request in two parts. First, I will cover the agreed to portions of my budget with County Administrator that the County

1:28:57Administrator is not fully funding. um in in the in their proposal. And I will explain several flaws with this proposal. Second, I will discuss the local requirement portion of my budget. Yeah, should I be next slide or do I have it? Oh next slide please.

1:29:17Thank you. Here is a comparison between the County Administrator's proposed budget for my office and my office's budget request for the agreed upon funding requirements. As you can see, the current fiscal year 2021 adopted budget for my office is under $4.3 million. The county administrator is proposing an increase just over $1 million for a total fiscal year 21-22 budget of just over $5.3 million. It's

1:29:48an increase of 24.23%. This increase includes salary, retirement, health insurance, and information technology components for board services. And it only has $117,716 for information technology that is required by Section 29008 for the multi-agency criminal justice information system for the multi-agency CGI. The county administrator's proposal is short six hundred seventy-one thousand four

1:30:18hundred sixty-five dollars. While the county agrees it is responsible to cover the entire entire component of the multi-agency sieges. County Administrator is proposing to cover less than fifteen percent of the actual expenditures. My office has been paying this county expense since 2000 since January of 2017. Since the clerk's revenue sources are limited, this office can no longer subsidize county expenses. I do not understand why the county is unable to cover the additional six hundred and seventy-one

1:30:48thousand. And I am not asking you to reimburse my office back to 2017. I'm only asking you to make the office whole starting next fiscal year. Even with COVID-19, the county will continue to experience increased revenues from property taxes, state revenue sharing, and sales taxes, including the increase to county revenues through the passage of Senate Bill 50 related to the taxation of remote and marketplace sales, which my office estimates will bring in an additional $6.7 million

1:31:19in County General Revenue next year in sales tax alone. If the county had been paying for these IT expenses since 2017 and you exclude the local requirements portion of my budget request, my budget increase for salary, retirement, and health insurance is only an increase of 8.39% over the fiscal year 2021. Next slide, please.

1:31:45Here I begin explaining the laws that require the county to fund the multi-agency sieges. Section 29.08 of Florida statutes directs the county to pay for certain port-related expenses. Section 1 directs the county to pay for the multi-agency sieges expense of the clerk and controller as provided by our Florida Constitution, Section 14 of Article 5. Next slide, please.

1:32:17Can you back up? I'm sorry, this life.

1:32:22Okay. I'm sorry, go forward again. Thank you. Just making sure we're on the right slide. Subsection H of section twenty nine point oh oh eight sub one provides what is encompassed in a multiagency CGIS, which includes information systems of the clerk of of courts office performing court related functions. Next slide, please.

1:32:44The County's responsibilities for the multi-agency sieges include upgrades and maintenance of the current equipment, maintenance and upgrades of supporting technology, infrastructure, and associated staff and services and expenses to assure continued information sharing and reporting of information to the state. Next slide, please.

1:33:06The county shall also provide additional information technology services, hardware and software as needed for the office of the Clerk of Circuit Court, the Clerk of Circuit and County Courts performing court-related functions. Next slide, please. All right, so here's a depiction of how Pasco County met its requirements to properly fund its obligation to the multi-agency CEGIS prior to January 2017. As you can see, the county covered the expenses related to the Sheriff, State Attorney, Public Defender Courts, and my office

1:33:36through December 2016. Next slide, please. This drawing depicts how the multi-agency seizures expenses for my office, the sheriff, and some of the courts shifted from the county to my office in January of 2017. Why did this happen? In your packet for this item is an email dated November 8, 2013, from Christine Johnson regarding the mainframe retirement project. Atacher emails a draft

1:34:06project charter and a list of systems still in use in the IBM mainframe. This project to retire the mainframe system was approved by the then Board of County Commissioners. The multi-agency Sieges was a significant part of this project. The mainframe system was costly to the county to maintain. It was based on old technology built in the 1970s. Key mainframe support personnel were scheduled to retire in 2015 and 16, and mainframe administrative

1:34:37skills were in very short supply. Technical support for the mainframe operating system release was discontinued by IBM effective May 2014. The county decided not to upgrade to a supported version as it would require a new hardware platform and would be extremely labor-intensive. Instead, the county elected to put all efforts into migration off of the old main instead of upgrading it. The county requested help from the clerk's office to retire the mainframe. Our

1:35:08office worked closely with the county to help it accomplish this goal. The success of the project was dependent on successfully completing the implementation of several prerequisite projects, such as the Utilities Customer Information System, the Acello Land Management System, the Clericus CGIS replacement, what I'm talking about, and the ERP financial system replacement. The multi-agency sieges was a large part of the success of the county's mainframe retirement project. Also included in your packet is Pasco

1:35:38County's sieges to Clericus conversion document, where County IT identified the sieges systems, subsystems and interfaces needed for the conversion project. My office wrote the Sheriff's Time Served application and the Sheriff's Time Served application interface to their booking system for the county. And we still maintain it today. My office hosts core clericus which the courts, state attorney, public defender and sheriff's offices access, and

1:36:08with which their systems interface. The law does not require the clerk's office to pay the expenses to support the courts, the state attorney, public defender, or the sheriff's office. The law requires all of these expenses to be paid by the county. Despite the statutory obligation, the county administrator is not proposing to fully fund these expenses. I don't know what authority it is to refuse to fully fund the multiagency CGIS because there is none. I have shown Florida I'm sorry, next slide.

1:36:42I have shown that Florida law requires the county to pay for the multi-agency sieges and my office has been paying the county's responsibilities since January 2017. The County agrees that it is responsible for the IT expenses of my office. Um the IT expenses and my office can no longer fund the county's responsibilities. Therefore, I request the board to fund 100% of the county IT ex of the IT expenditures next fiscal year as required by law. This would provide a total increase of

1:37:12$1,711,206 for fiscal year 21-22. Again, And taking out the IT expenses that are the responsibility of the county and not my office will only provide for a budget increase to my office of 8.39% over county fiscal year 2021. This concludes the first portion of my budget presentation. The second portion relates to local requirements. It's a completely different discussion. Mr. Chairman, with your approval,

1:37:42I would like to take a moment for discussion regarding my budget request related to information technology at this time and hopefully come to an agreement before moving forward to my second portion of my presentation.

1:37:58Well we're not lawyers, so we need we need someone else to explain to us what the heck the law says. So I mean that's like Mr.

1:38:06Steinstein. I have I have already advised the administrator that the the the that the clerk is on solid ground with regard to fund the Her opinion regarding the information technology expenses. What I think the dispute is now is whether or not we have the ability to phase that since it's now been presented as one lump sum.

1:38:35Do we have the ability to phase that in or are we required to fund any software, hardware that the clerk desires to use, i whatever whatever they decide to put in, do we have to fund that as at a hundred percent? In this case, I think that all of the that that over the years The county hasn't objected to the migration to clericus,

1:39:07and that's the system that all the justice partners are using. This is not an unusual or different system.

1:39:20And I think under uh y the the clerk is correct that under these sections of of the statute and um the constitution, the legislature has hoisted this expense upon the Board of County Commissioners.

1:39:42My recommendation is based upon the fact that it is a significant one you're asking would be 40% increase of our budget, and I'm okay phasing it in over a period of years. And that is why we recommended what we recommended. Is that we phase it in over a period of three years, assuming revenue continues to be good.

1:40:03I will say that this item isn't even mentioned in the budget budget transmittal letter. And when you look at her budget, uh just to pull it up, IT maintenance and support is only nine hundred thousand dollars. So I There's a disconnect there between what you're hearing today and what we've heard in the past on what this money is for. So, you know, this is, I'm a little, I'm not sure I fully understand that because what they've walked through with us is

1:40:33how the costs have shifted in IT. And we have said we will fund over a period of three years, get up to 100%, but we can't do it in one hand.

1:40:44And that's my recommendation.

1:40:46Is a portion of this, uh Mr. Files, is a portion of that in the budget for this year. What's that? Are we phasing it in this this coming year?

1:40:56We increased, you'd have to go back to slide number two, we recommended an increase of over a million dollars in her budget. That includes the salary retirement increases. But keep in mind her entire salary line in her requested budget was $7.7 million.

1:41:17That includes local requirements which we'll get to.

1:41:23This is something that has previously, you know, we have not been asked to do this before over the past several years. And so even when my department department comes into me with a new report, it has to go through a process and we don't necessarily fund everything year one, even if it's a high priority. You know we didn't fund Rescue 223 because it's a high priority. We we did not have the money to do that under the property list. So my recommendation in order to

1:41:53fund a variety of things across the county is to phase this in over a period of two to three years.

1:41:59So what percent are we facing it in this year, knowing that we weren't expecting it?

1:42:07So we've I think this year it's about a 40% we are paying forty percent of the IT line item that they have shown to us in the past. Four zero can't tell from this slide.

1:42:20Um on the slide um it is the down towards the bottom of the slide. The BCC funding for IT components of board services and then the BCC funding for IT as required for the multi-agency sieges. Those are the two lines. Those these numbers haven't changed.

1:42:36So it was one month. item. We look at it and we we've ratioed it out over a period of three years, two if revenue is good next year. But that was that was my recommendation.

1:42:48I believe your staff mumped it. We separated it.

1:42:53But it's it's forty percent of the IT cost

1:42:57of the of the board services IT and of the multi agency sieges. So what I was told was that um they weren't going to that the county was not going to pay the entire amount for the sieges portion and that it would be uh phased in over three years, which it's very tight for my budget. My budget is less than one percent of the county's budget and spending the um what's lacking is the six hundred and seventy one thousand. That's a lot of money to my office and I could be

1:43:27providing um better services to our community. I could be implementing efficiencies in my office with that. Um I I'm having a hard time staffing my vacant positions because the starting pay is so low. It's

1:43:41um I asked someone a question about

1:43:45Yes, but I can use that funding because it it's taking funding away from me to being able to do that. My recording money is being able to do that.

1:43:55No, no, you don't understand. The reason why I have that $671,000 is not coming from the county's budget. It's coming from my recording budget. My my fee budget from recording is paying the county's expenses. So I can't use that fee money to spend money in my courts area or for my recording area or any other area for that matter or on IT because I'm spent paying the county's expenses. And um this isn't a like a a new request. The county had been paying on this since the beginning of time. It

1:44:25just stopped in 2016 when we converted from CGIS to clericus. What I'm doing is I found, oh, uh, why hasn't the county been paying for this since the time that we converted? We took on a lot to help the county get off of the mainframe. We wrote applications, we wrote interfaces, we support those things, we support work cloor cleric is everything is done for the county to help the county get off of the mainframe. And then I realized why we've been paying that bill the whole time. It's time for the county to take that back. I d I just want to be treated equally

1:44:56along with my other constitutionals. I know that um I guess Mr.

1:45:00Hey I'm I'm I'm gonna say the sheriff came to us a few years ago and asked us to please raise the salaries. We didn't do it in one year, we phased it in in three years. It's uh it's

1:45:13It's a process.

1:45:14It's yeah, it's a process. So I think forty percent I mean I sounds like we need to do it. Um And whether it gets there in one year or or two years or three years

1:45:27I think I think phasing it in for a new request is is a standard operating procedure for us.

1:45:35But this is your expense. Why would you phase it in? I'm asking you to pay for your expenses instead of shifting it to my office to take it. Take it back.

1:45:43Mr. Chairman, can I can I ask this one question? I just want to ask one question um to the clerk. Um

1:45:53in the every in the budget, if I'm not correct, and this might have to go to County Administrator too. In the budget for your office and um the property producers office as well as the supervisor elections is there a four per s we're doing a four percent increase in raises. For races, four percent increase in impact. Are you looking to do more of that or are you are you looking to stay at the four percent?

1:46:17No, not with that.

1:46:18You're not? Okay. Just asking. So you're you're you're not looking to do anything in any from the top down more than four percent for any one employee?

1:46:29Yeah.

1:46:31This salaries.

1:46:35Because buildings of the budget's already the salaries.

1:46:38Right.

1:46:39Increases.

1:46:40It's a very small portion of my entire team.

1:46:42Yeah, on the table I saw before that you mentioned you said salaries, insurance, et cetera. So the salaries in the budget then the so in the budget the the four percent's already included.

1:46:53Uh yes, in the line that four sixty four line that includes the four percent.

1:46:57So which has been accepted?

1:47:01Yes, that's correct. Okay. I don't uh I I probably don't understand the question.

1:47:05I don't know. Mr. Chairman Mariano. Yeah, sir. So it's been four years?

1:47:09It's been since January two thousand seven.

1:47:11Then you wait till now to bring it to us to say we want to get caught up on it?

1:47:15Right.

1:47:17I don't know.

1:47:18COVID really rocked the clerk's world statewide. So we we dove in, we looked at the statutes, and then we looked at um our expenses and our revenues um and we really tick took a look at it and we found this

1:47:31Did things change with the state? Are we being treated in others in the state because of the way we have our course set up?

1:47:37No. the counties paid for the multi-agency seatches throughout the state.

1:48:00And slide ten is an exentation first. Yes.

1:48:04Can you go to slide ten, please? Nine, please. Slide nine?

1:48:07Yes. You said you did an increase of four percent on your salary, retirement, and health, and then this says it's a ten point eight percent? Is this consistent with the others? With the four percent? Ten

1:48:21point eight. I'm sorry, where was that?

1:48:24Slide nine.

1:48:26That's not health process. That includes inc increases the health insurance, the retirement contribution. That's not just salary. No. Increases. Yeah. We have the same issue on our side with T. Here we go, it's in the nine. F R S.

1:48:43She's talking about a the dark.

1:48:47It's one more. Mm-hmm.

1:48:54Next one.

1:48:54It's the next one.

1:48:58Okay, well

1:49:00Oh that's weird.

1:49:01Oh your slides and our slides are a number different, but it's okay.

1:49:05Yeah. Oh there's one.

1:49:08Did you have other d figures in here that you want us to look at?

1:49:12And what I presented is the breakdown the uh second s second slide it provides the breakdown.

1:49:24Why don't we go to the second part of this?

1:49:29So Commissioner Fitzpatrick, did you have any other questions?

1:49:35I wanted to see the I wanted to look at the whole financial statement. I

1:49:39emailed

1:49:39you

1:49:40the financial statement uh back in April.

1:49:44Because this IT, that's about what is that ninety percent of the total IT?

1:49:52No. Um so I have IT that board is responsible for and then I have IT that my office is responsible for.

1:50:00And I think when the break when you showed me the breakdown it was ninety percent was from the board and ten percent was for your office. So for

1:50:08financial services uh staff.

1:50:10So then is this including the ninety percent?

1:50:13So in in the uh line fours uh salaries and health insurance, that line, that 464 line, it does include that 90% cost for my finance department goes towards board related work.

1:50:32It's not eighteen.

1:50:34So back on slide 2, you have BCC funding for IT components on board services and BCC funding for IT as required by 29.008.

1:50:44Correct.

1:50:45Those two numbers combined, is that's ninety percent of your total IT costs? Because you said the B O C C uses ninety percent.

1:50:52No, I said the finance department in my office performs ninety percent work for the board and ten percent work for the clerk. So like accounts payable, general ledger, treasury.

1:51:06How much do you cop pay for your finance department? If we're utilizing ninety percent of that and you do ninety percent of the work for us and ten percent for you, what is the total cost to you and then are we paying the ninety percent that we're utilizing?

1:51:20I don't have that number with me.

1:51:23I I I think we are in that respect. We did adjust because that we were low and we did adjust to cover ninety percent. But that was not a

1:51:34on the finance side because that was a separate discussion. I think that's in the four sixty four.

1:51:38It is, it's in the four sixty

1:51:39four. But I think we adjusted to cover our our use of the

1:51:43but I I do agree with us having to cover the cost of the portion of the finance department that we do you we do utilize. I

1:51:51think that was the salary retirement health insurance line because that doesn't that I think that's where that is. The the IT the two IT lines again we saw that as one line.

1:52:04Yeah. We'll want it to phase that in over a period of two to three years depending on revenue.

1:52:11Because as a county, the county's responsible for paying do the Florida statute for Is it misdemeanor and juvenile courts? What court departments is the county

1:52:29Are you talking about for technology? Um, it's for the criminal side, so it would be like the juvenile, the uh misdemeanor, felony, the criminal side. So the other chart that you saw with like the green box listed out the areas.

1:52:49So the slide before that where was all white shows Thank you.

1:52:59The items um identified in green are those um part of the sieges, multi-agency sieges with the county's responsibility.

1:53:09And then do you have a separate breakdown for those costs?

1:53:13I can get them for you, but we went um we did a line item review of the IT cost with the county administration staff and your IT staff back in I think it was February of this year and everyone agreed to the uh list of items and the cost associated. So that's when um once we have that agreement, put it into the budget request.

1:53:51Do you have a total cost for all of the IT on slide eight? And I know our slide eight okay. Yes, this slide. Do you have a cost for all of IT right here? And then the separate cost for the part in green that we're responsible for?

1:54:05So if you go back to the second slide, the multi-agency CGI slides, is that to the total cost for it? The seven eighty nine number.

1:54:21What's slide? Uh the second.

1:54:23On slide two. So then are we covering the salary plus the seven eighty nine? And then that's how we're coming up with the one

1:54:30the salary is um really nothing to do with IT. It

1:54:33has

1:54:33to do with our our board related um employees. And the line for multi-agency SEGIS is the system.

1:54:57So the seven hundred and eighty nine thousand, are we covering any of that cost? You're covering about a hundred and seventeen

1:55:02thousand.

1:55:05in the proposed budget.

1:55:12So it's short about 671,000.

1:55:18And then that's where the six hundred thousand about six hundred thousand comes from.

1:55:22Yeah, the six uh six hundred seventy one. Yes.

1:55:32Can I get a math number? Because I'm lost on nurse.

1:55:35On slide two, it's right here at six hundred and seventy. She's

1:55:38got her own math number, I think.

1:55:41Uh so what is so the forty what is the forty percent of the IT that we're covering? What so what forty six

1:55:50percent

1:55:50but yeah. Wait, wait. So the total the the total IT needs are what?

1:55:56Okay.

1:55:58um if you

1:55:59if you go with her slide She's saying it's uh 1.2 million and we're covering 575 now.

1:56:08Okay.

1:56:09But again in in her budgets in the middle, some of that cost is varied under salaries and not is not separated out as the IT cost. Because her whole IT cost in her budget's the middle is about nine hundred thousand dollars.

1:56:23Okay, well can we get clarification on that? Well I guess

1:56:26we're going to be able to do that.

1:56:31she's only asking for an additional six hundred and seventy one thousand, not nine hundred thousand. But no, no, no, no.

1:56:38Okay, Heather Grimes, Chief Administrative Officer and Clerk of the Court. Um, I think what Mr. Biles was speaking about and the difference in the numbers is because some of the IT culture are programmers that maintain the system. So we have a very detailed budget that's that um show that allocates where our IT staff work. And so this is the program the programming time plus the cost for maintaining the application that's not staff related.

1:57:04Uh okay, you kinda lost me. We're we're we're covering their salaries somewhere else, right?

1:57:11Aren't we covering their salaries in the the You're covering a hundred and seventeen thousand? I think the multiple

1:57:17salaries are covered out of the money that would come from the state. Or the the clerk.

1:57:22Mm-hmm.

1:57:24It's coming up. Yeah,

1:57:25recording

1:57:26one. So it's

1:57:29Or replace if we're getting it's funded by the state. And where

1:57:32does that money come from?

1:57:35Reporting and and fees.

1:57:37Fees. Is that where it's supposed to come out of? Yes. Okay, so that so we need to subtract the salaries out of this because that comes from somewhere else. So the total number is nine hundred. And we're paying five hundred thousand Towards the nine hundred?

1:57:54Five seventy five is what we came up. And it what part of that is the st it's not finding

1:57:59it.

1:58:01It was based on analysis that isn't here. It was based on a different analysis between our team spent a couple months with their team going through their budget and based on that analysis that came up to me for a recommendation. The recommendation was based on you know, to supplement what they're doing for their fees at five seventy five, but that over a period of two to three years we would fund a hundred percent, but we couldn't bite it off all in one year.

1:58:30And that's the

1:58:31ultimate difference is we put 46% in this year. The goal would be is if we have good revenue next year that we cover the rest of it. I will say that our estimates in your budget were already in line with the brand new estimates from the state because we'd already projected that into the budget. So there is no new additional revenue.

1:58:52Yeah, I was going to ask about that. Um the online sales tax. Is that

1:58:56contemplated? Yes, we had already projected that into the budget. We and our revenue estimates that are in the budget actually work.

1:59:07We're now what basically close to what the state is saying our revenue will be. Okay. But we have our own revenue estimates.

1:59:14One other place that sometimes we have found money in the past at the end was when our constitutional officers say, like Senator Fasana, Oh, I have this much left over in my budget. And

1:59:28we

1:59:28We haven't heard that from him this year, so where's that?

1:59:30I think we'll have some I I don't know what the final number is. I will say that obviously the tax collector does a very good job of uh Making a profit every year and returning that just but that's one time money. We budgeted into the capital program. It does not go into the operating room, but it's one time money. All the constitutionals have returned money generally, obviously different levels. Well they're required.

2:00:02We don't have money. So perhaps so I'm comfortable phasing you in, but keeping an eye on, and I'd like to do it in two years, not three. Um and if we do get some money back from the um uh tax collector's office. Maybe we can do something else.

2:00:23Yeah, I it would have to be above what we estimate. I think we probably estimated his average.

2:00:30Well maybe we get to fifty percent this year instead of forty percent or you know, whatever it is. But there may be some funds there that we can um

2:00:40That's

2:00:40just the suggestion I have.

2:00:42Mr. Chairman Mariano, is there any reason we can't go through the rest of the slides too? We've got like ten more slides to go.

2:00:49I have to Could we go to slide seven? I want to make sure that Commissioner Starkey's uh question was answered about staff things. Seven. Number seven.

2:00:58Two seven.

2:01:00Okay, so it the law requires the county, uh, as part of the multi agency CGIS to fund not just the maintenance and the equipment and the maintenance upgrades of supporting technology infrastructure and the associated staff. So the CEGIS uh money includes the money to fund the programmers that um manage the multi agency sieges.

2:01:24But I thought we c we covered that already in your salary, retirement and everything. No.

2:01:31Again, I think the way it was presented is different than the way it's being presented. Some of the money we aren't funding this year but would fund in the future years would go to

2:01:45positions not the buyer for maintaining software, but the positions that need to program to maintain the software, much like we do in our IT department.

2:01:53There is there is team there is there's that needed to support the software.

2:02:01We were recommending a phase in approach of that just because it's too big of an ask to do one year. You know, we're not arguing with the department. It's just we would like to phase it in, but it's too big of a request to ask. Because if you if you add it in, her budget goes from a 24% increase to a 40% increase. And there isn't a department in the county that are constitution offices and mechanics got before. Mr.

2:02:24Chairman

2:02:24M and

2:02:25again it's your expenses. Mr.

2:02:26Chairman Mr. Mariano. So looking at the next two slides being a w we have resistance to get there, but um the next slide does list where it's something we may not fund from the filing fees. The next one over on slide twelve on the handout sheet, I'm not sure what it shows there, but it says um counties shall be it's highlighted in yellow. reasonable and necessary salaries, costs and expenses. I mean twenty percent's a pretty good increase, twenty five percent's a pretty good increase, forty percent's a little extreme,

2:02:57trying to phasing over three is I think is reasonable.

2:03:03I don't find it reasonable. I just wanna say that. I I'm sorry, I disagree. Uh this is an expense of the counties that's not supposed to be buried by my office.

2:03:23If the Florida statute states that we're supposed to cover the cost of the IT for CGIS, then

2:03:31I think that should be covered.

2:03:34I do too.

2:03:36Unless there's a precedent law because if we didn't have to pay since two thousand seventeen, well, then we were lucky.

2:03:45Uh

2:03:49And if it was being phased in from twenty seventeen, it would have had a reasonable growth every year over four years and you wouldn't have seen a massive jump from twenty percent to forty percent of growth.

2:04:05So her budget increase that we're recommending is greater than the CJ's cost, she can reallocate the funds within her budget. Well we're we are recommending increase of over a million dollars in her budget. She wants to put that all on sieges, she can do that.

2:04:19Okay, so if we go back to twenty seventeen and increase her budget eight percent and then so twenty eighteen increase an additional eight and eight and eight over where would it be at today?

2:04:28But we didn't.

2:04:30But Florida statute shows that we should have them.

2:04:35But we didn't. The request was not made. That was covered some other way. The cost was covered some other way.

2:04:42Mr. Chairman Mari Commissioner Perspective separate from going on now, you had a separate clerk there that did a had a separate budget request than the other clerk now that has a different budget request. We can't go back in in in time and look at what a former clerk requested for their budget and how they use their funds.

2:05:01No, but if a previous

2:05:07constitutional officer lowered their budget And then increase their budget. Well Lower okay, if they someone lowered their budget and we know it was lowered too low, and then we do an increase or double the increase because we know it was estimated too low. Well over the past four years it may have been estimated too low, but if we take the inflation as it should have been over the past five years, would we be more or less than where she's requesting the

2:05:37funds today?

2:05:39The if the prior clerk lowered their own budget, they lowered their own budget. That was their decision.

2:05:43We take the approach that is a presenter.

2:05:46We didn't lower it. They w that was their request.

2:05:49I discussed that with them.

2:05:51I mean that was that that was the clerk's budget request, whether it be here or somewhere else, that was their budget request.

2:05:58I would like more clarification from the Florida statute if we're not going to honor what Florida stat if we're gonna go against what Florida statute states.

2:06:06I don't think you're s the administrator is saying he's going against what Florida statute states. He's saying he's going to phase in the county's responsibility over multiple fiscal years.

2:06:18And I'm asking the county to Me it's responsibility this next fiscal year. The county administrator just said that I could reallocate my resources to pay for this. That's what the office has been doing. The problem is is that 91% of my budget is people.

2:06:38It's not capital um projects, it's not um anything else but people because uh you know facilities is taken care of by the county. So reallocating what money? Cut positions. We've cut positions already, eleven percent since two thousand and ten. We can move on.

2:07:02Okay, thank you.

2:07:05Alright, so this is the presentation. Yes, sir, um on the local requirements. Let me f okay, so the second portion of my budget presentation covers the local requirements and specifically it is the annex courthouse in Newport Ritchie. Florida law also requires the county to fund court-related local requirements for the clerk and controller's office. I will present to you the language of Florida statutes and the obligations undertaken by Pasco County resulting from local bills passed in the

2:07:36res in the request. I'm sorry, local bills passed at the request of your predecessors on the Board of County Commissioners. I will take you through those statutes to explain the legal foundation for. Mm-hmm. So as you can see on this slide Uh the court related functions of my office are funded from a portion of filing fees, service charges, costs and fines established in the Florida statutes. Stated another way, the court-related functions of my office are fee funded. My

2:08:06office is not funded by the state and we are not in the legislative appropriations process.

2:08:15In section 2835, oh go back one slide, I'm sorry.

2:08:20Thank you. In this section of the law, it's clear that the clerk's offices may not use court-related fee revenue to pay for local requirements. As you can see, there are two functions identified as local requirements. those that are provided in the law and those that are provided in local optional programs.

2:08:41The local requirements provided for in my office's budget request falls under the first part, those that are requ provided in the law. This is an important distinction as the legal opinion from the County Attorney's Office covers local requirements that fall into the second part, those that are provided in local optional programs, which are inapplicable to my request. Next slide, please.

2:09:07Section 928.00 not sorry Section 29.0 is subsection 2 of Florida statutes provides that the county shall pay reasonable and necessary salaries, costs, and expenses of the state court system, including associated staff and expenses to meet local requirements. Next slide, please.

2:09:30Subsection 2A1 goes on to state what constitutes a local requirement. Local requirements are resources required of a local jurisdiction as a result of special factors or circumstances and further states that local requirements exist when imposed pursuant to an expressed statutory directive based on such factors as provided in subparagraph B. Next slide.

2:09:53So subparagraph 2B states that factors and circumstances that result in local requirements include the factors presented here on the slide. The factors that my budget request is based upon is factor number four, the number and location of court facilities. What does Florida law say about the number and location of court facilities? Florida law requires only one courthouse located in the county seat. Next slide, please.

2:10:21As I begin to review the law related to the number and location of courthouses, we must first understand the related provisions in the Florida Constitution. Article 8, Section 1K of Florida Constitution specifically directs each county designate a county seat, which shall be the location of principal offices and permanent records of all county officers. As you know, our county seat is here in Dade City since 1887. Next slide, please.

2:10:49Florida statutes provide further direction regarding the location of the courthouses. Section 138.09 of Florida statutes requires the county to build courthouses at the county to build a courthouse at the county seat. Commissioners, there is no provision in Florida law that requires the county to have more than one vote one courthouse. Next slide, please.

2:11:12Section 125.222 of Florida statutes limits the type of court-related activity to be conducted in an auxiliary courthouse if one is established. It states that trial by jury may not be conducted in auxiliary county offices where such offices have been established and are maintained under authorization of law. General Florida law provides the county must designate a county seat where the principal offices of county officers are located. It also requires one courthouse to be built at

2:11:42the county seat. Florida law does not require more than one courthouse. It further directs that jury trials are not to be conducted in auxiliary courthouses. However, in Pasco County, we have two full-service courthouses, one located in the county seat of Dade City and a second annexed courthouse located more than an hour's drive from the county seat in Newport Ritchie. Jury trials are conducted at Pasco's Annex Courthouse, so why is Pasco different than what is provided in general law? Pasco

2:12:13County has two special legislative acts which allowed it to build an auxiliary courthouse in Newport Ritchie and allows the auxiliary courthouse to function as a second full service courthouse. Next slide, please.

2:12:30Chapter 59-1715 section one of Florida Law states that Pasco County Board of County Commissioners is authorized to establish a courthouse annex in the western portion of Pasco County, which may be made available to all county officials for the carrying on and conducting of the functions of their respective offices as services to the residents and citizens of such area. Florida law allows counties to build auxiliary courthouses if needed to provide services to

2:13:00its community due to local requirements such as geographic factors. Next slide, please. In addition. Chapter sixty three dash seventeen sixty one, section one of Florida the laws of Florida states that trial by jury may be had and held in addition to any county in addition to the county seat in any branch of the Courthouse within Pasco County. The clerk and court, the clerk of any court, shall provide necessary court facilities and maintain such offices within such branch

2:13:30courthouse. However, the principal offices of such clerks shall not be removed from the county seat. Florida law does not allow counties to hold jury trials at auxiliary courthouses. The county established a local requirement when requested and obtained special laws to build a West Side Courthouse and perform jury trials at the Annex Courthouse to address a local need. Therefore, the county was and is required to fund the cost of the Clark and Controller's Office to provide court-related services in

2:14:01that Annex Courthouse pursuant to section 29.008 of Florida statutes. Before I go further, I want to point out that through the forward thinking and resident serving efforts of your predecessors, Pasco achieved special laws allowing its second location. Previous commissioners have the vision, the foresight and wisdom to grant this action, which is unique to Pasco. I can't even imagine our west side residents having to travel to Dade City to conduct important legal business or serve

2:14:31jury trial. Such service comes at a cost that my office can no longer afford to absorb. Today I'm simply asking you to follow through with the support of those long-ago decisions and actions. The Annex was a citizen and service-oriented improvement, one of our county's cornerstones, born in 1959. And per Florida statute, the county is forever responsible for it. Next slide, please.

2:14:57The county and my office have interpreted the law related to the number and location of court facilities differently. The county does not believe the annex is a local requirement, while my office does. Outside of seeking courts to resolve this dispute, there is very little that can be done to resolve our differences without taking a collaborative approach today. I have been asking for months to resolve the difference interpretations between our two offices. So here I am. One last time to meet together and resolve our differences. I propose a meeting with the chairman and the county attorney. Without

2:15:28further delay, to see if we can resolve our differences related to the local requirement. There is no part of me that wants to dispute once this dispute to go beyond this room, I do not want to drag outside parties into Pasco's business and growing pains. We were elected to be problem solvers of this great county. We were elected to escort Pasco into a very bright future. But as I said at the beginning of this presentation, I need your help, I need your understanding, and most of all, I need your

2:15:58support in making my budget comply with the law. Thank you.

2:16:05Mr. Chairman Mariano on this issue I've advised the the County Administrator that this is not a local requirement. If you note the dates that the clerk has cited to the special acts, they were from the fifties and sixties. The in that time frame These were all your expenses. In the 90s, this expense was shifted to the state court system. These were dean

2:16:36state court facilities, and they were shifted to the state court system. That means the clerks corporation is responsible for funding both courthouses. I've not had any example. And there are multiple counties with multiple courthouses that the County Commission is funding. The courthouse. quote auxiliary courthouse or annex courthouse. There are Penellis

2:17:07has multiple courthouses. Sarasota has multiple courthouses. Volusia has multiple course houses.

2:17:16Mm-hmm.

2:17:17They're a state court function. They're having state court proceedings in those in those buildings. So I can't agree that the the that the clerk's interpretation that because you have two courthouses, that it's a local requirement. In addition, you have had the chief judge. Before you on multiple occasions over the years since I've been your county attorney, saying he needs more courtrooms. You have just enough courtrooms

2:17:48in both courthouses. to manage that function.

2:17:55The clerk's basic interpretation is if you shut down West Pasco, Those courtrooms would all have to be built on the each s east side to m to maintain the state court function. And so whether it's on that side of the county or whether it's on this side of the county, that operation is a state function, not yours as the Board of County Commissioners.

2:18:25Because I have a second full service courthouse which I do believe is unique to Pasco where civil and criminal are happening on both sides of the county. We're at jury trials on two courthouses. I have to have more staff and I have more expenses because of it.

2:18:42If it was at one location I wouldn't need as many.

2:18:48And

2:18:49I'm not proposing to Sounds like we put a courthouse. We either gotta shut some of it down on one side or I mean And I'm I'm not I'm I'm not sure what you're asking us 'cause

2:18:59that's not what I'm asking.

2:19:00Well

2:19:04Um

2:19:08Should the state fees be funding the courthouse and all the fees that are collected and then isn't there a state fund that can reimburse for some of these fees?

2:19:20So um let's see, can you back up to slide it might be slide thirteen.

2:19:29What does it say?

2:19:39Right.

2:19:40So

2:19:41What's good?

2:19:44Go forward one more.

2:19:48I can't find it. So I'll just say it's in there. I just don't know. I can't remember which slide it's on. So the fees that are uh collected in twenty-eight point thirty-five Florida statutes. So if you see the slide that says twenty thirty-five, um it provides what those fees can be used for and it also says what those fees cannot be used for. And the part that I quoted on that slide shows that it cannot be used to pay for Yeah.

2:20:15Excuse me.

2:20:15So what I'm

2:20:16saying requirement it can be used to fund it.

2:20:19Correct. Say that again? I didn't hear that.

2:20:21If it's not a local requirement, it it's only this interpretation that it is a local requirement that says the state can't fund it. So it's a s it's sort of a circular argument. If the clerk is right that it's a local requirement, then no the state can't fund it. And it is your responsibility to fund it. I find it hard to believe that when in the nineties, I mean, this is being funded out of the state budget since the nineties, when

2:20:52this was all transferred to state government. That's that's what the whole purpose of this constitutional amendment was, was that this board didn't have to fund state facilities, state court facilities. Um and so That's the that's the loggerheads in the two interpretations of of state law. And

2:21:16that's all based on interpretation. But basically if um I feel like it's reasonable that we're trying to do a 40% when it's hard to come up with the monies that you need here in the county to do everything you need to do. We don't just take home those kind of increases like you've asked for each year for any of them. We have to work through our budget, through the monies we

2:21:46got coming in, and that that's what we work on. So Anyone else have anything? There's no action required at all, so.

2:21:57Unless she was to take it.

2:22:00No, and I appreciate it, Mr. Chairman. You know, I just you know an an issue on this specific issue and I have to follow my counsel as obviously as a county commissioner and their determination that's what we should be going by as a board.

2:22:15I agree. You've got your legal counsel.

2:22:17Okay.

2:22:20Great. Thank you.

2:22:21All right. Thank you.

2:22:26And I believe that is our last item and we'll go on to um