PDD 23-0238 CPA 22-09 Greenfield Dell Webb River Reserve

1:39:39Don't be a stranger.

1:39:45Yeah,

1:39:46right. Promises, promises.

1:39:55Yeah.

1:39:56Okay.

1:40:03Hello again. Amy Heiler with Long Range Planning as she brings up the PowerPoint.

1:40:17So the item before you is a comprehensive plan amendment. You will be acting as the local planning agency for this matter. It's going to, it's in the name of PDD 23-0238, a comprehensive plan amendment, CPA 2209, Greenfield Delva River Reserve PD. This is a planned development future land use change. The property is located in the South Market area and urban service area. And I wanted to run uh just a little history by

1:40:47you as we proceed forward with this project. So on May 25th, 2010, the Board of County Commissioners uh adopted a future land use change on this area from RES 1 to IL, uh Light Industrial Office. Res 3, residential 3 dwelling units per gross acre, res 12 residential 12 dwelling units per gross acre, and con conservation lands, which was effective August 1st, 2010.

1:41:17As you see here, these are the proposed levels of development that was achieved within that plan, did have associated sub-area policy explanation. So the existing or current entitlements or density intensity as is is 1,316 dwelling units of residential, 1,4 1, 1,044, I'm sorry, square feet of office. There is light industrial, which allows for 616,200,

1:41:50616, 100%. 200,000 square feet business park and 103,000 uh 265,000 retail office. I don't know why that was so hard for me.

1:42:02Additionally, on November 12, 2014, the Board of County Commissioners approved a rezoning petition from AC Agricultural District to MPD Master Plan Unit Development, which further implemented the approved levels of development within the associated sub-area policy. In that master plan unit development, there were two 712 dwelling units of single Family detached or attached, 604 dwelling units of multifamily apartments and condos, 144,000 square feet

1:42:32of office, 548,000 square feet of light business or light industrial business park, and 174,465 mixed-use area, which re which included retail office and public services. Additionally, about a year later. The applicant or the property owner came in and established a mixed use uh trip reduction measure plan in this area. Um and it did align with the conditions of

1:43:02approval that were previously approved in 2014.

1:43:09So, why are we here today? The applicant is actually proposing an amendment to the existing sub-area policy, which is in the name of Belfruit Zenada. They are proposing to reduce the entitlements that are already existing. As you can see here, the residential entitlements are being reduced to 1,205. The office entitlements are being reduced to twenty one thousand six hundred square feet. The industrial is being uh uh combined um

1:43:39basically into a hundred and sixty thousand square feet and the existing uh retail is being converted to commercial retail and also reduced to approximately thirty-two thousand square feet. So, with the applicant's proposal, the future land use map will need to be changed. So the applicant's proposing a map amendment to 2-15 in sheet 22 from IL Office, Res 12, Res 3, and CON to PD on approximately 557

1:44:10acres. This area is located on the west and east side of Shady Hills Road, approximately 1.1 feet. Miles north of State Road 52. Amendment to the res or resolution to the applicant's proposal is an amendment to the flu map 2-15 and sheet 22, as well as an amendment to the existing sub-area policy 7.1.10 and the sub-area map 2-910. There is also a subsequent rezoning petition for MP. Running

1:44:42concurrently with this project, you will hear that at a later date. Here's the visual or the aerial located for this site. This is the existing future land use.

1:44:56The proposed future land use.

1:45:00And conceptual plans identifying where the industrial will be located. As you can see on here, you probably can't see the text, so I'll let you know what the colors mean. The purple along the north end is proposed for light industrial. The pinkish color, salmon color along the middle is going to be proposed mixed use, and the orange on the southern side is proposed multifamily. Yeah. These are the following policies that the proposed amendment is consistent with.

1:45:33And with that, we recommend the local planning agency find the proposed amendment consistent with the comprehensive plan and recommend approval to the Board of County Commissioners. I'd be happy to answer any questions you may have on this project.

1:45:45Have any questions for Amy? The the green spots on the map are

1:45:50Conservation. Correct. And um So

1:45:54the

1:45:54lighter green

1:45:55I mean?

1:45:55On this one or on the original. The

1:45:57lighter green on this one, yeah.

1:45:58Yep. So those the lighter green is gonna be your open space park areas. The darker green is existing conservation lands. And uh and it's actually a great question. Um just to make note, the area that is bright green or dark green for the conservation lands, there is an existing critical linkage that is in this area. We have been in coordination with parks, rec and natural resources to ensure this area is preserved. So as you'll notice, the boundary from the existing MPUD is being modified. Um you'll see here

1:46:28everything outside of that dark green is what you're hearing today because we are not touching that area.

1:46:45Good afternoon again. Barbara Wilhite, sixty three twenty seven Grand Boulevard for the applicants. I would just make one note that I think The PowerPoint said that we're amending the CON C O N to P D. We d the con is not part of our amendment. We pulled our P D off of the con um so that we could Show everybody that we weren't touching the con. So our MPUD includes the con because um so that we would continue to own it and maintain it under an environment man under an environmental

1:47:16management plan for um environmental lands, but we left the land use as con.

1:47:23I'm gonna see if I can run through this in five minutes. I didn't ask for extra time, so let's see. Um I'm gonna try to respect your time.

1:47:34Yeah. What I think is just really interesting to look at is and I'm really proud to bring this project forward because what was a project in the property owner's eye when it was entitled before it was entitled by the property owner, the Dorset family. We are it's now time to develop the property, bring the property forward, and when you do that, you have to change things. And actually we're changing a lot for the better here. Um the existing land use on excuse me, the existing land use and zoning, we're gonna kinda talk land use and zoning because it's interesting to talk about both of them. It's really dry just

1:48:04to talk about one of them. Not that Amy's presentation was dry at all. But

1:48:10Currently there's thirteen um hundred uh one thousand three hundred and sixteen residential units um being proposed. Of all of those are non-age restricted, so that's thirteen hundred and uh sixteen generating students um for the school system. We're proposing twelve hundred and five residential units, decreasing that, and of those sev seven hundred and thirty will be age restricted. So we're going from 1,316 homes to 475 homes that'll generate at a maximum that'll generate

1:48:40children for the schools. The other thing you'll notice is the amount of non-residential that's changing as well as multifamily. 604 apartments today down to 304, uh 304 multifamily apartments. The three the 131 you see in that right-hand column is built to rent. As we bring our MPD forward, we have had comments on that from commissioners about making those platted townhomes, but it's not an

1:49:10it's not an issue at this point. Um we'll look at that as we bring the MPD forward. What we did do is right size the project. What's the right amount of commercial, what's the right amount of office? The east side of this project is going to be an award well award-winning Pulti Del Web community. Um and we're really proud to have them doing that in this area of the county. The west side is going to be a mudderum project around the mudderum mixed use trip reduction measures. Mudderum, what's nice about Mudderum is it sets the scale. It

1:49:41actually tells you this is for this many This much acreage and this many units this is how much office and and commercial you should have. So those are how we arrived at those numbers, twenty one thousand six hundred square feet of office and thirty two thousand square feet of commercial and retail. The light industrial You will note there's quite a bit of non residential on the left hand column. In meetings with County Economic Development, Pasco Now County Economic Development Council, the Dorset family owns, the same family that owns

1:50:11this property, owns the 300 acres that you looked at their land use amendment to go to IL on the west side of the Suncoast Parkway. So And looking at the planning for this area and where everybody thought the best location for viable light industrial along the Sun Coast Parkway, they thought it would be much better planned on the west side of the Suncoast Parkway, but there's already industrial uses. So that's so we took We m we right-sided this project, put figured out what the right

1:50:41amount of commercial and office is, figured out a good plan for it and mudder, and we took the light industrial component and and put it over where it should be over on the west side, still with frontage on Suncoast Parkway, over in what's becoming an industrial node over that way.

1:51:00Let me see if there's any other highlights of of the differences between the two. We did keep um An area for light industrial um within this project. So there still is a light industrial, 160 uh thousand square feet of light industrial that is on the west side of this project within north of the Mudder area.

1:51:19So it's the west side of Shady Hills, but it's the east side of Suncoast Park.

1:51:23Isn't that fun?

1:51:27Very fun trying to keep that clear, but thank you. This this is the MPD plan as you can see the commitment that was made by the property owner years ago to this conservation corridor. It's still here. We're not changing it. You can see that in the green.

1:51:46This is Dell Webb's um project and some of their sample um homes.

1:51:55This is one of their an amenity that they have. They plan on spending between twelve million and fifteen million dollars on their amenity here?

1:52:05As I described, this is the Mudderham side, this is the west side of the east side of the Sun Coast Parkway. And we've got the Mudarim principles um at play there.

1:52:17This shows you in context of this project in relation to the ecological corridor, Cruise Lake Park. And where this project fits in. By the way, the property that's we've talked about

1:52:31I guess I can't highlight it, but on the west side you can kind of see the property on the west side's pretty much directly across from this project is where the west side property is, where the industrial is going to the three hundred acres going to industrial. This is pretty cool slide here. This is something we put together to show bike pedestrian connectivity, not only within our project and the obligations of our project, but what's going on in the area. So we asked the team what is going on in this area. We know our obligation by code

1:53:01is to put five-foot sidewalks on both sides of our project along its frontage on Shady Hills Road. So that's a base, we have to do that. So then we looked what's going on to the north, what exit what exists as far as a sidewalk or a trail or a path, what is proposed to be constructed by others because there are approved projects here. As you go north from our project, there's some gaps, then there's some sidewalks you see in yellow existing. Where you see the blue

1:53:31there. There's two schools, Mary Dr. Mary Giella and Cruise Lake, and then there's a project that I did, Kr Krella. Krella has to do

1:53:43between where the star is coming down in front of Mary Giella across their property and then coming up the sidewalk that already exists in front of Cruise Lake. the the folks that are doing the North Pasco um corporate center have to fill in the blue um along uh along their frontage Both of those blues on either side in front of Krella along Krella and the what Krella has to do off-site in front of the school as well as North Pasco Corporate Center, those have been commitments for eight-foot

1:54:13pass. So they've increased what they're required to do instead of five foot, they're doing eight-foot pass. And then down soft winds, there's a requirement for a sidewalk um along s down soft winds as well. So you see that in yellow. Really notably on this is is what you see in pink, that is the Suncoast Trail, the much coveted trail that people like to connect to. Many people have to go and park their car to enjoy that trail. the residents of our subdivision um and through this the sidewalk system others

1:54:43will be able to access that trail um via bike or walking.

1:54:51My client has committed to instead of five foot sidewalks required by the code, eight foot pass with with along their project front edges. They've committed to fill in the gaps with eight foot pass, as you can see in the orange there, the off-site improvement. That orange portion is of eligible for mobility fee credits from the bike ped portion. Um but significantly Remember our east side is fifty-five plus. No kids are going up that way to the schools. Maybe grandparents at this point,

1:55:21maybe grandkids. But my client didn't come in and say We don't need to fill in the gap 'cause nobody's going up that way. Um, they looked at it and said, We're willing to do that off site improvement. And um even though the budget to do those off-site gap improvements exceed their credits. anticipate to exceed their credits. But again, they're, you know, I think they're looking at this as a community and they also want access to that Sun Coast Trail as well.

1:55:50By taking the two columns that I had, existing versus proposed and and right and right-sizing this project and taking the industrial and putting it over on soft winds, where there's more of a transportation network, by the way, there's Hayes Road, there's Hudson Road, there's Soft Winds. Um The industrial if it would have been on this project would have been just on Shady Hills Road. By taking this project and redoing it um in the way we have, we reduced trips by sixty four percent In the future

1:56:20land use. And by seventy-four percent in the MPUD. And likewise we reduce the trip gen the school uh children generation to the schools as well.

1:56:34With that, if you have any questions, got my team here. They would love to answer any questions.

1:56:39Chris, I don't have a question, I have a comment. I r I really like how this looks, Barbara. I think you all have done a great job. I know off and on we've I was talking to Bowers Dorset earlier and This has been a long time coming. And so we have been coordinating with him and formerly the late King Healy and way back when and we used to have a school in here and then We said no, it d it it's so close to the other school and we're still gonna have to figure out how

1:57:09to accommodate the multifamily at Mary Giella but we'll figure it out 'cause there's other projects coming, but I really like the senior adult here and I I think it's I like it. So,

1:57:21I

1:57:21just want to do that. comment. He just stole all my words.

1:57:26He was reading out

1:57:27your paper there. You can put it over here, Peter, if you want, if you gotta you know put your book out.

1:57:36I think it's beautiful.

1:57:38Thank you. Right. We're really proud of it. Thank you.

1:57:41Barbara, just a quick question. Can you go two slides down? I I'm just not familiar

1:57:45with I can attempt to do that.

1:57:48Uh you The the red dash line there's the kink in Shady Hills, the red dash line through there, is that A realignment of Shady Hills?

1:57:58So let's see if we can get our master plan back up here.

1:58:01That's the one I was looking for.

1:58:03So there is a curve on Shady Hills Road. Our project there is a route study, an old one, but it's still an oldie but a goody, um, to make Shady Hills Road four four lanes. And to realign that Get rid of the curve. This project has to accommodate the right-of-way for that realignment and the four-laning. The uh it's quite significant to

1:58:34when you do that, because normally you take when we do right-of-way preservation, you take the road and you take a little bit from this side, a little bit from this side, but when you take out a curve. You take out a curve. And so you take quite a bit of property off the west side of this, of of this property. So um It's quite a bit of a commitment to accommodate that uh future straightening out of of that curve.

1:58:57So h how are you how do you accommodate that? That's part of the single family?

1:59:01It's over it's on the b butterham side. Which is a mixed use anyhow, so it's a little easier to accommodate that and from a planning perspective. Okay. So yeah, it's on the it's on the west side of the project where that right away comes from. It's on the MPUD plan. If which is a w up towards the front.

1:59:20Would you potentially add single family on the On the other side, then if that kink is straightened out?

1:59:27So you can see the red here, the alignment here? The red is the realign is the right-of-way that we have to convey. Um

1:59:36So

1:59:37So that that curve wouldn't be there anymore.

1:59:39Do I understand that that area's trendy? So that would all then become

1:59:43residential.

1:59:44Yeah. Drain me well, that's going to be a pond.

1:59:49So yeah, no no additional homes would be added when that kink is straightened out. Correct, correct.

1:59:55We're also not only are we accommodating right of way, we're c we're coming the drainage, we're taking the drainage for that realignment of that of the road in that area. or the improvement of the road in our area, we're taking the drainage and putting it in our ponds.

2:00:10So Barbara, you said you're doing eight foot trails on both sides. Um, is that in the gap too? Is that gonna be the same? Yes. Wow,

2:00:18nice. Yeah, it's it's when you see it laying out like that and you actually see an area where you're gonna be have work, schools, recreation. And connectivity and a regional trail. I'm like, wow.

2:00:33Sometimes the planning process works. Is that

2:00:36a spot where the planners did better than the lawyers?

2:00:40Absolutely not.

2:00:47Thank you. I know you did some public to speak.

2:00:53Barbara, I do agree with the rest of the Planning Commission that it it's a good plan. My only Slight concern is I guess it's a question is how important is it to your client that you have Townhomes adjacent to the Sun Coast. I mean 'cause My general experience when I'm driving on the Sun Coast is, you know, when you have apartments next to it, not a big deal from a compatibility standpoint, you're not looking down on People's backyards and people aren't People aren't looking up from their backyards at the Sun Coast. When you're

2:01:24But townhomes, especially platted townhomes That's a little different.

2:01:32I mean Has your client thought about just only putting multifamily apartments there and not putting townhomes? Next to the Son Coast. It also seems like kind of an underutilization of the property to put Lower density townhomes. Right on I mean that just seems like a a place that's sort of begging for higher density apartments and not Town homes. So I guess I'm asking how important are the townhomes to this is not an issue for your land use amendment, because the land

2:02:02use amendment just has a bunch of residential entitlement.

2:02:04It does, correct.

2:02:05But When you get to the zoning, I mean I get that you could enhance the buffering there, but it just seems like it's Kind of a waste of the land to be putting Low density townhomes right on the Sun Coasts.

2:02:20I don't know the answer, but we can certainly work on the answer as we'll be back um next month with the M PUD. I appreciate the the question. Um I

2:02:32That's seller retained property, so there's not a developer. Um so we need to figure that out. And it's gonna take a look at the

2:02:38lower density stuff should be on the east side of Shady Hills, you know, near the the ecological quarter. I mean that kind of makes sense and so It seems like it would make sense to have a high density right on the Sun Coast and then kinda Bring it to L.

2:02:53Yeah, they're more clear.

2:02:58on the zone coast. That's my concern.

2:03:00Definitely we'll take a look at that.

2:03:02Okay. Yeah, it's to that.

2:03:06Okay, are any other questions? Not saying I'm a planner. I'm the I'm no planner, but but

2:03:16Nobody's going to school for it.

2:03:20Okay. Any other comments, questions, concerns?

2:03:29And I'll come forward.

2:03:35Excuse me, Mr. Chairman Mariano. I do just want to state on the record we have nobody signed up on WebEx for virtual comment for any item today. Okay. I think uh are

2:03:44you the only person here to speak,

2:03:45sir? I apologize, I have a cough. My name's uh Matthew Cornelson. I live at uh [address removed]. And uh thank you very much

2:03:56for

2:03:56this opportunity to say something. I think uh Mr. Williams. made a statement that I thought it it rang a bell in my head. He said, We'll have to look at some of these things down the road. And I'm reminded Of something that I often ask my boys. I have two young sons, and I ask them, When did Noah build the ark? And the answer to the question, of course, is before the flood. This is the Planning

2:04:27Commission. I have had the good fortune of attending the Shady Hills Park and Civic Association meetings. for the past couple months. Where Commissioner Mariano has been very kind and spent multiple hours with us. And he indicated that this was the venue where we should come voice our concerns as regards this um plan in particular. One of the big concerns that I have about this is Shady

2:04:57Hills Road itself. I would like to thank the developers for wanting to put an eight foot wide path as opposed to a five foot wide path. Because I think we can all agree. that Shady Hills Road from County Line Road to Softwind is an embarrassment. Um It is the only four-lane road in Pasco County that I am familiar with that has two lanes that are paved. and two lanes that are dirt on the outside.

2:05:29The trail that is being proposed here will provide a very nice extra lane for all the cars. that are going to be driving down this road. to drive on. just as they do on the other side of Softwind. There is a nice graph that was shown in the presentation where the number of trips are going to be decreased. on an hourly rate. during the peak hours. and there was reference to a

2:05:59decision made in 2010, a decision made in 2014. that led to these Number on the left there. Well the fact is that right now there are no trips. The number of trips per peak hour right now is zero. and yet on page two of, I believe, the memorandum from the Planning uh Commission, it says that no transportation study is needed Because there is a decrease. in

2:06:29the peak hour transportation needs. And uh As a Shady Hills resident, this just confuses me. We have No ability in this area to absorb this kind of traffic. There are three schools. adjoining this project and the other project, the Gary Plastics. um project that was put through. And there simply doesn't seem to be a little bit more than a little bit. Any effort. By

2:07:01Whomever happens to be responsible. to address the traffic issues Before They happen.

2:07:11If anybody here has tried to turn left on County Line Road, tried to turn left on Shady Hills Road. anywhere from County Line Road down to Softwood during rush hour. There is no way. That this number of units can be absorbed without a change to Shady Hills Road. It's simply not possible. I turn left on Shady Hills Road every morning to come south. During the week. And when

2:07:41I do, it takes me between forty-five seconds and a minute and a half every time. And you say, Well that's not a big deal. And it's not a big deal when it's just me. But when you add in hundreds of vehicles at peak hours, Traffic's not gonna move. It isn't moving now. And that's what we already see on Shady Hills Road. And so I'm hopeful that steps are taken that somebody, whether it's the developer, whether it's the Planning Commission, whether it's the County Commission, somebody

2:08:11says that something needs to be done about Shady Hills Road before. We let all of these developments come in. Thank you very much for your time.

2:08:21Thank you.

2:08:23Anybody have any questions? Do we have an idea of uh how long um 'cause I know Shady Hills is is Plat it here. Planned out to be widened. uh to four lanes. Did does anybody know how long that's gonna be? Um

2:08:40What the plan is for that.

2:08:44I don't believe it's in the current five year CIP but There may be somebody on I don't know if somebody Ben Cat, do you know?

2:08:53Yeah, I as far as I comment is not the best for

2:09:00So um But I think you need to hear from the applicant about

2:09:05Yeah.

2:09:07Shady Hills because it's not

2:09:12I'm not saying the gentleman's wrong, but I think the applicant's traffic engineer has a different opinion about the capacity of Shady Hills Road.

2:09:19Uh when CAD What I could Pasco County Traffic Operations Manager. Uh like I said, I mean s I don't have an answer to address the capacity issues because uh It goes to the funding and CIP level. But as far as my knowledge, We do not have anything on the plans for the next uh Ten years, at least for winding the shady hills.

2:09:41Yeah.

2:09:42I love from the Traffic operations point of view, yes, we can do some cosmetic or band-aid stuff, addressing the safety issues along uh Shady Hills. But other than that. Uh there's nothing from traffic operational perspective we can.

2:10:04The CIP is changed every year. And so sometimes What's in the existing CIP may not reflect what You know If we start to see an an influx of growth in a certain area, we may say, well we may need to change our CIP to add roadways or and delete some other roadways. So And a good example of that is Old Pasco Road. on the east side of the county where We started to see a lot of development applications come on Old Pasco Road and

2:10:34so Our board said, Hey, we need to get this in the L R D P we need to get it in the CIP and now it's starting to get design money, construction money and so The CIP is a moving target. I so I think Bencat what Bent Kat is saying is maybe true today. But It can change every year and the board adopts the CIP every year so so I believe it is in the L R T P so so It's any road that's in our L R T Penny for Pasco. can be advanced in our CIP

2:11:04if there's adequate funding. And there's a desire by our board to accelerate a road.

2:11:10That that is correct, yes.

2:11:12Well and as we've seen here before it's the chicken and the egg thing, right? So, you know, they're not gonna widen the road unless there's developments, but there's no need to widen the road if there's no developments. So

2:11:24But I have to do it.

2:11:28You have to think understand that there's a lot of roads that need to be widened in the county. And they're all competing for the same dollars and so You know, we get people here and say, Why haven't you done Collier Parkway? Why haven't you done Trinity Boulevard? Why haven't you done This road or that road. And so they're all competing for the same dollars and that's why the board prioritizes that through the CIP process. Um But Like I said, Old Pasco's a good example of if there's an upgrowth in an area that they do revisit What

2:11:58goes in the CIP?

2:12:01Barbara, did you want to a add anything or have Steve address?

2:12:04Sure, I will. Let me just a couple things. Um one is

2:12:08Wait, wait before you do that though, did we hear from all public comment?

2:12:15Okay. If

2:12:15you want to speak, please come up toward the front so I can Get you up here to speak. I don't want to keep it a secret.

2:12:25Okay, if you could give us your name and address please and

2:12:29Joe Rickle live at well [address removed]. We're talking about traffic and four laning and we don't have the growth. A big part of the problem is The traffic that is there now isn't Shady Hills areas, Highland Forest. It's the traffic going through. It's a corridor north. Which if any of you been on that road even close to rush hour after rush hour till way early in the morning, late at night. Like stated before, impossible.

2:13:00It's a steady line of traffic. Yeah smart. and to get this extra growth and then put it on both sides of the road that you're gonna influx coming trying to get on. to Shady Hills Road. to say, Well, we gotta wait until we have growth. You already have the growth. It's not in this county. It's County North. But they're using our roads. And this other thing is I see all this nice water. Where's that coming from? We

2:13:30got water problems now with the well field as the crossbar. They shut down the wells over down south on uh Heritage Pines. that dried up Hunter Lake and the homeowners shut them down. Where's the water gonna come from this? Pasco County's dumping hundreds of thousands of gallons a day of water on the side of the road. Every day almost. I passed it again today. What is that about?

2:14:00Up and down Shady Hills and County Line. They dump hundreds of thousands of gallons just to open the valve and run it. Clear the lines because of the way the water system's set up. And I see all this nice lakes and stuff that they're proposing here, where's it coming from? Along with what are we doing with the traffic?

2:14:20Okay. Any questions?

2:14:24Yeah.

2:14:29Hi there, Jen Kerouak, 15925. This is a little high for me. [address removed]. Um and I just want to mention that uh this is, you know, I believe that the community um, you know, thinks that this development obviously is much nicer than looking at, you know. 20 Gary Plastics plants. And

2:14:59we do see the effort from the developer as the first gentleman mentioned with regards to widening, making trails, so on and so forth. But there are still several concerns, the main one being the road. And I think that what I've seen today is what I continue to see, which is an extreme concern. For the community and honestly, me as a Pasco County resident in general,

2:15:30that it appears. that the right hand doesn't know what the left hand's doing. Because just as we saw, and I don't mean this disrespectfully, it's just the facts. The road's supposed to be widened. No, it's not. Yes, it is. No, it's not. I've been to every MPO meeting. I've seen District One get $50 million just the last MPO meeting. Fifty million dollars for two and

2:16:01a half miles, okay? We are a main thoroughfare from north to south. The end. I've worked in transportation before. I can tell you what I'm seeing and what I've already seen. In 2022, 468 car accidents.

2:16:24Many people injured, bike bicyclists, pedestrians. One man lost his leg Okay? These things are real, they're happening, and we continue to bring it forward. And I know you're only one part. of of the process here. But you know, again, I come to you to appeal to you because the things that are being planned here. Are negatively impacting

2:16:54the residents of Shady Hills Community. They're negatively impacting. people North and South Residents from Hernando, they use that. It's a main thoroughfare from north to south. Mr. Moody admitted that he takes the 52 exit and Shady Hills Road to go north to where he needs to go. These things must be looked at. and and really

2:17:24taking a look at when you're talking apartments instead of the nice community and and again I'm not a planner. Okay, I can only think with my common sense. And to me, you put apartments, now you're increasing traffic. four schools. Nineteen seventy four is when Shady Hills Elementary School was put in. No sidewalks, no improvements to the road. Parents parked on the side of the road. If a

2:17:54fire truck tried coming through, it would be a disaster. And I've seen that happen already. And I don't want to see it anymore. And so the Shady Hills civic association is appealing to you. that you really take a good look at this. Because the improvements need to happen before further building happens because the building has already come and

2:18:25it's continuing to grow. So I appreciate your time, gentlemen.

2:18:30Okay, thank you for coming.

2:18:35All right. Does anybody here have any questions?

2:18:41Barbara?

2:18:43Thank you very much. Um I would note with regard to schools in the package, staff's package Uh it does talk about Mary GL elementary and the capacity. Those are without considering that the seven hundred and thirty units are age restricted. So those numbers are very high. And the numbers were rerun. Um Richard reran the the numbers. So Um

2:19:06More of the generation of what The entitled project that we already have would have been looking at versus our age restricted project. So I wanted to make sure we I pointed that out.

2:19:16If I can jump in there just a second. So just like Rhodes, we constantly monitor growth. Currently Marriage Yellow is under capacity by a little bit. Cruise Lake Middle has a lot of capacity. Um You know, but we monitor all the schools around the county and and work to do adjust our CIPs just like roads. So as needed, we add wings or build new schools or whatever the case may be. So uh when I mentioned, you know, that's something we'll have to figure out. Well, we've

2:19:46known about this project for a long time. We anticipated a lot more students from this project knowing that's coming, but now there's fewer students, but Yeah. We still empate Probably building a wing on Margiella at some point.

2:20:02Thank you.

2:20:02Thank you. The um when I talked about four laning I was talking about our side of Shady H Shady Hills Road. You heard the first speaker he's talking about soft winds north the county line. That's on the west side of of um Sun Coast Parkway. So the route study and The four laning that I know about is where our project is, which is on the east side of the Suncoast Parkway in that route study. The other thing is um Apartments, it's

2:20:33actually a decrease in apartments. We're currently approved for Get my number here. Currently approved for 604 apartments, and it's um almost a half three hundred and four apartments that we're proposing with this MPUD amendment.

2:20:53Steve Henry, we were not required to do any traffic study because as you could tell by those numbers, it's a significant traffic reduction as a result of this project over what's already approved. But when we heard that the neighbors were concerned about traffic the client engaged Steve Henry to do the traffic study that he would have done if he was required to do one. So I'd like for him to come up and talk to you about traffic. Thank you.

2:21:15Thank you.

2:21:20Go afternoon. Steve Henry, Linkson Associates, 5023 West Laurel, Tampa, 33607. Um as uh Barbara had indicated. This project and and when we did the methodology, we were not required to do a needs assessment. or a timing and phasing for the rezoning because we are as as shown with significant decrease in traffic. However, because of the area, the client decided to go ahead and do a timing and phasing. And not only did we do a timing and phasing, most timing and phasing are only based on PM peak hour, we did AM and PM

2:21:50peak hour to look at the impact on um Shady Hills Road. And based on the analysis that we've done, taking into account the existing traffic, a growth rate to future, and then adding in our traffic, it does operate within acceptable level of service based on the generalized level of service of the roadways. So from that standpoint, it will it does operate today. It that will operate when we're done. And then in addition to doing the timing and phasing that we've done here, look at it from a generalized

2:22:20standpoint. When we get ready to develop, we'll have to do detailed uh analysis of our access and we'll have to demonstrate what geometry is required as far as turn lanes may be required and to demonstrate that it will also operate acceptable levels of service or we won't get the permit for it. So from that standpoint it's it's we've done gone above and beyond and again this is a significant decrease over what they could go out there today and build. So from that standpoint I think the neighbors Yeah, again I understand it's that there will be an increase, but the

2:22:51reality is it will be a significant decrease over what could be done today. What

2:22:54is the

2:22:54level of service today on Shady Hills Road? Today it's it's C and will be C when

2:23:01we're done. It's C it's C today and after your development it'll still be C. Correct.

2:23:16And I was just gonna emphasize to the Planning Commission members when I, you know, talked about CIP priorities and what roads the county builds. And it's probably the same issue with schools. I mean, y you when you have a limited pool of money, you tend to improve the roads that are most Congested.

2:23:34Mm-hmm.

2:23:38If a road's operating level serves C, that's actually not that bad compared to some roadways in Pasco County. So I understand the residents experien their actual experience may not be level service D, I don't know. Well. if the experts are saying that this is level of service C, I can tell you we have other

2:23:55things.

2:24:03Okay. so it's

2:24:03D today or C today?

2:24:05It is. I won't tell you what it is today.

2:24:10And what we did is we used we went and did a growth rate. So today it is operating at And again, we we didn't look at the actual level of storm, we looked at the available capacity, but I I can estimate. So today it is C. Okay. And then when you look at twenty thirty with a growth rate Plus R is it would go to D.

2:24:32Twenty thirty based on the reduced in entitlement. Correct, yes,

2:24:37correct. And are you only Giving the right of way for the straightening of the curve? You're not actually doing the improvement of the straightening of the curve.

2:24:48Correct, correct.

2:24:52And there's no plan to straighten that curve other than a concept on

2:24:57some paper? Well when the county eventually widens the road, they w the county would straighten the curve.

2:25:05Yeah. It just sounds like there's a missed opportunity not to do it. Now. Mm-hmm. two and that's a

2:25:13quite notorious Curve. Right. Yeah, part and part of the issue we we we have looked at it, but part of the issue is to do it today. and to build it to where it needs to be for the future. So you would be building whether it's the east or west two lanes of an ultimate four lane urban roadway. And so when you start trying to build a small section of a urban two-lane roadway, it gets to be very difficult

2:25:44to do it in one little piece. That is the issue. Yes, it would be great just to straighten it out, but the reality is you'd want to put it where it needs to go, and that's a very difficult thing to do with a small section, given you are going from a rural roadway to an urban roadway, which could change the elevations of the roadway, the drainage. Yeah. It's it's not being done now.

2:26:08Right, but I just wanted to explain to you why. We we've actually looked at it because we we did look at that whether that was an opportunity, but unfortunately because of those factors, it's it's a difficult thing to do for a small piece of roadway. When she

2:26:20Well from my perspective and just for your consideration, uh it seems to me like One of the complaints is is that you know, we're trying to reduce traffic on the road and I I think By approving this. We're actually reducing the potential traffic on that road by Less than half. Mm-hmm. Um and I think that's a pretty darn good first step. I think uh you know unfortunately we can't do everything that we'd like to do all at once, all over the county. There's everybody there's lots of people that like to have the

2:26:50road paved. And and I agree that it's a problem. I've been on that road many times. But We have to start somewhere and one one place we can start is Bye. Taking a development that was approved for s over sixteen hundred trips. And reduce it to four hundred. I think that's a pretty good darn good first step. That's my opinion.

2:27:13But I think you've hit the nail on the head. I mean we had to Keep in mind that this proposal is for a project which already has entitlements, already has an approved MPUD. Right. So I understand the concern of the residents that there's no traffic there today, but there would be nothing There they could go out and build today under their currently approved MPUD and the situation would be

2:27:43worse than what we're being asked to approve today.

2:27:47Plus we wouldn't have pedestrian pathways up in that gap. Yes. And then we're talking about com filling in that gap which is which is pretty huge from a From a safety perspective.

2:27:57I think as somebody said when they came up here it's our job to plan for the future and I think this is a good direction to go.

2:28:04All

2:28:04that being

2:28:05said. And I'm not against this project. I don't want it to be taken against this project.

2:28:14I understand the technical complication. in building half of a roadway when you currently have a two-lane roadway that runs down the center of the right-of-way. And I don't know. If we're saying right now Yeah. Roadway improvements aren't on the schedule for at least ten years. Quite. I'd like to happen and I know you can't control that, but at the county level do something about it. I don't want to

2:28:44see any more dead body monuments around that curve on Shady Hills Road. Somebody needs to go out and do that. And that's been a problem, not that's developed in a year or five years. That's been going on for decades.

2:28:58I don't think it's a fair comment really from for the county to say that it's not on the agenda for ten years because we don't know. It's re it's reassessed

2:29:07currently.

2:29:10Consider fixing that d this is not that's not an unknown problem. It's a known safety hazard. And I understand there's places where there's traffic jams. And people may be inconvenienced that they have to wait, but people on those curves die.

2:29:25Mm-hmm.

2:29:26and some priority should be given to that. Not that I expect this developer to fix it. That's a request of the count.

2:29:37It's good to note too for people that are concerned about traffic that you know, uh I'm I'm one of the same people that's concerned about traffic, but unfortunately trees don't pay taxes and roadways are built with taxes, so We we have to uh you know, we have to have the development there as well and you know, development equals homes and equals businesses which pay millage, which then goes towards supporting these projects to build these So it's that goes back to my point of the chicken and the egg. Something I didn't quite understand

2:30:08prior to being on the Planning Commission, but I I understand a little better now too. So, you know, this this goes a long way t approving this, um, reduces those existing entitlements and also goes a long way towards uh getting to that next step of creating those millages to create the tax revenue to f to improve some of these roads.

2:30:29Well and it's not just tax revenue, they also pay mobility fees, which also goes towards

2:30:33Stole my idea again, the chicken and the egg and David was talking about Old Pasco Road. When I moved over when I moved to Pasco County more than twenty years ago, O Pasco Road was an old dirt road. Well most of it was. Not all of it. And now they're working on it. Now that's twenty plus years. That won't go how many plus

2:30:54This in a way is kind of a as someone said, a benefit. Chicken or egg came first. You need the population because I know we all know I hope we all know that you need a population out there t before they build the road. Case in point. Old Pasco wrote. Case closed. So I I see it as I can understand how the folks feel about this because they would like to see the road develop first, but that ain't gonna happen. We all know that. You need the population out there first. And I and

2:31:25as it was stated earlier This is a good concept because they are reducing the population that could grow out there. We talked about the the entitlements I had for that area out there. Well I'm not I not gonna debate with anybody on it. I'm just telling you how I feel about it and how I see it, the growth the growth can't be a positive thing. Not that I'm a Negative on growth or positive on growth, it happens. But I s I I I can see this happening for the folks out there. This will be a benefit to them because in twenty years from now Wherever

2:31:56I'm at, I can say that Shady Hills Road will be developed in the easy. Widen. So and as far as safety goes, I can't I I don't know if the county can put out more police officer or sheriffs out there or the state can patrol a little bit better to try to reduce the the impact of of uh uh driving habits of individuals may encourage them to slow down a little bit but uh Anyway, uh that's my comment and I I appreciate y'all listening to it.

2:32:25Thank you, Peter.

2:32:28Anything else

2:32:29up here? Well the other comment I would make is that I do encourage the residents to get Involved in you know, the road planning process of the county. I mean we have I would say at our typical MPO meetings there's maybe three residents that show up. When our at our budget hearings where the board approves the CIP and decides which roads we're gonna build in the county. We get Unless the firefighters show up. Th there's like there's nobody in the audience.

2:33:00And so I'm not sure that that's a good idea. I mean I'm it's great that you're showing up today. But the place where these decisions are made about where where Shady Hills is gonna be and the priority for the county. are made at the MPO level, they're made at the Board of County Commissioners level. And This planning commission I mean they know about mobility fees and they know this project's gonna pay mobility fees, but there's the second local option gas tax, there's tax increment funds, there's penny for Pasco funds. All of those

2:33:30things go into how we develop our CIP for the county And that's all done through our CFP development process and the approval of our budget and I would encourage the residents to get involved in that process because that's where the real decision is made about what roads are going to get improved in Pasco County. Not in the context of a land use hearing. So I know this particular developer is the target today. And I get the concern of the residents, but There's a whole nother process that's

2:34:00that's used to determine Whether our road money goes to Shady Hills or whether it goes to Trinity Boulevard or Collier Parkway or Whatever other roads go in the county. And That's where I think the residents need to probably have in a little more input.

2:34:15Good comment. Well said.

2:34:17I'll go ahead and motion that this uh project be approved. I'll second.

2:34:22So we have a motion and a second. Further discussion of the motion. If not, all in favor signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed, like, sign. Motion carries.