P-5 PDD-247650 Kenton CCMPUD rezoning
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The county’s minutes for Planning Commission, Oct 5, 2023
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What was said
Machine transcription of 1h 52m of recording, with speaker names inferred from voice matching. 69% of 440 lines carry a name. It shows what was said, not what was decided, and both the words and the names can be wrong.
Mr. Chairman we're gonna move to item P five and uh that will be presented to you by Cap Gavin Covey.
We gotta take it off.
Mm-hmm. Peter's gotta leave just so
I can't. Thank you.
Yeah, we're gonna break. We're gonna take our brief lesson. I just broke the hammer.
Yeah,
one
of the
thoughts.
He doesn't need any more strength.
All right.
So Mr. Gavin Covey will be presenting item P five.
Okay.
Okay, so a couple things. First thing I did receive an additional letter of opposition that I would like to include.
Okay.
Move to receive and file.
Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed, like, sign?
Uh the second item would be that expartes for Mr. Poole, Mr. Ponslets, and Mr. Girardi were given to the clerk.
And I provided one to the clerk too. All right.
And actually one more thing, I'm so sorry. Would would we like a quick overview of Connected City now? I know Clark kinda touched on it briefly beforehand. I know we're very busy. Okay. Would you like to just move on?
Brief overview, yeah.
Yeah, so like Clark said, you know, twenty fifteen uh state statue allows for the pilot program of Connected City. twenty seventeen comes enabling documents with the Master Rowley Plan, the comprehensive plan, financial plan. Uh general intent is to keep people connected socially, mo uh mobily and tech technologically, provide high speed internet and Areas like parks and a lot of the other a lot of the district. We also wanted to promote business incubation in the business cores and the urban core in downtown. And
a lot of the funding is based on developers and their contributions, and as development comes in, they build the roads or they contribute mobility fees, which then the county could then use to build the roads in the future. We also just hired a consultant for a monitoring program for uh the roads in Connected City. So hopefully we'll have a report where the the biggest track is.
Okay.
All right, so this is
P D D twenty four seventy six fifty Kenton uh C C M P U D. Yeah.
Okay, okay. So this is a zoning amendment rezoning from an AC agricultural district to a connected city master plan unit development district. This is to allow for 800 multifamily dwelling units and 106,286 square feet of service-ready site acreage uses on approximately 176 acres. And this is located on the southwest corner of the intersection of Kenton Road and Tyndall Road. Here's a site location within the county. Here is a site location within Connected City.
Here is that location within the Connected City SPA zone. It's in the community hub.
Here's a brief aerial of the site.
Here is a zoning for the site which is A C. Future Land uh land use which is A G. And then we have the match plan right here.
And so the append is uh requesting three variations from the code, uh section eight oh five point six to allow parcels under single ownership to retain responsibility for the maintenance and upkeep of common areas instead of a C D D or HOA. Uh section 907.1 is to reduce the number of uh required parking spots to 1.9 and then uh for multifamily units and then section 901.6.11 to now provide interconnections to the east or west of the property. So section 8.4 or 805.6 parcels under single ownership, such as an
apartment complex, may act as the responsible entity for the maintenance and upkeep of common areas. The new minimum for required parking is still above the 85th percentile, according to the Institute of Traffic Engineers. And then section 901.6 T11. To the east exists a large category one of Wetland and to the west is the existing Kenton Road. Um they're not gonna provide individual access to the parcels that are off to the east, but they will provide one access point uh to the
new, newly built Kenton Road in the future. And so this comes with you with a recommendation of approval with conditions.
Okay.
Any questions?
Applicant present.
You have my name.
Well she's pulling uh materials up. Clark Hobby Hobby and Hobby PA again have been sworn. Um Planning commissioners, you heard in the last project a great deal of discussion about connected city. This area is a little bit different. It's in a different area of Connected City called the Community Hub. And when the graphics come up I'll explain a little bit more about uh community hub to you. But the um the upshot of community hub is its design, here
we go. Can we get a little bit more of the screen here?
Just taking its sweet time.
Sorry about that. I in any event, uh as she works on that, I've got to see further down on the plan.
I gotta see the orange, it's further down.
There keep going. Keep going. Keep going. Keep going. You're almost there. Keep going. Okay. All right. The the area you see the the the planning area within Connected City that we're in is called Community Hub and it starts over here at Curley Road and it includes uh Maratha And Eppershin. And the idea and the planning concepts here were to start at a suburban level of density on this side. and
to move to higher densities as you go to the west because this area right here will be the densest area called the urban core of all of Connected City. The site we're dealing with is the site that abuts it, that goes from right here Down to right here. Okay? And you all may recall the April MPUD which is on this property right here that you saw last year. and there's an existing dirt Kenton Road that runs
up along here the new Kenton Road that the Aprilli peop people are building up to about right there Will all be located on their their right-of-way such that the existing dirt road will remain on the west side. And then when we take over, the the remainder of the right-of-way within their MPUD will remain. So we'll be building within the April MPUD right here. then we will build building on our property alone
from there on up. The net effect of that is, in addition to the cross-section stuff you'll see in just a minute from our engineer Joe Simeno, is that there will be the existing 50 feet of McHendry that will remain in the dirt road condition for the foreseeable future, and it will provide part of our buffer from any of our development to their side. Now, we can move on to other slides. I think you've already seen the
master roadway plan, so maybe if we can go to slide three.
We're having some technical difficulties.
So if you want to. I'll just keep going and I can I can come back to this stuff. The upshot of it of it is Connected City foresaw extremely urban development patterns being established along the seventy five corridor. And my client uh went and met with the county staff about this project about two, two and a half years ago. And it was at that time that we were inform informed that the remainder of Connected City does not have any further
single family detached Uh units available. There are no more single family detached units available for all of Connected City. However, again, as I reminded you earlier, what Connected City calls multifamily also includes duplexes and townhouses, then in other parts of the code, we might have called those single-family attached units. That's not how Connected City works. So what you have before you is uh, and this
was done at staff's request, we were originally looking at having a significant portion of this site as single family detached housing. staff told us that would not meet the intent of Connected City in that and you saw the previous uh slide just a second ago, they want us as we get further north in our site to apprent approach a medium density condition throughout the site with higher density towards the north. So the
plan that we originally had which had a combination of single family detached And townhouse units morphed into townhouses and apartments. Okay? So the majority of the units that are in our approval are for townhouses. So it's gonna be four, you know, the entitlements are for two uh 450 townhouses and 350 multifamily units. But when it's presented to you all that comes off as eight hundred multifamily units and when
you first see it you think we're gonna be build eight hundred apartments. I can assure you that is not the case. Um if we could go two slides down that would be helpful. You uh actually go one one up if you don't mind. Again, this is the same slide you saw earlier that planned for and has the dip the transportation plan and the connected city planning documents are all based around this large amount of multifamily as opposed
to a smaller amount of single family. And again, that accounts for duplexes, villas, row houses, and townhouses. And so that's what you're seeing in this project. Can we go to the next slide?
Okay, here's what is allowed in the community hub area, and you can see it's exactly what staff is asking us to do here. Multifamily, mixed-use areas serving as community centers, and then these are the housing types that are generally allowed. But note again, even though community hub in general allowed single-family detached, there are no No more single family detached in all of Connected City. So next slide.
I just and and if you could blow it up or maybe you can see it here. I just wanted to point out for you all, this goes back a long time. We had these discussions in late twenty twenty one with uh a number of uh planning staff and you can see that Ernie said This is a major improvement. Thank you for showing, you know, the townhouses. You were too low when you had the single family detached here, and now you've moved the single family detached units to townhouses and you've taken the townhouse
areas to apartments. Okay? So again, we were given very specific instructions by county staff on what to do on the site. I would point out when you look at the master plan for the site, and I can't remember if we'll go back to that in a minute, maybe, but the The uh as the site approaches uh the urban core that's where if we have the service ready site acreage that's where it's gonna be because that's office and maybe some retail and that needs to
be in close proximity to the urban core and that's where the multifamily is gonna be. We don't think we're gonna have an extensive amount of multi-family, i.e. apartments up there. But we will have the required service-ready site acreage. We also, it's it's kind of hard to tell in these graphics, but we are building a significant portion of the Kenton extension. Um I don't have the exact linear footage, but I think it's between three-quarters of a mile and one mile. So it's a very, very extensive developer commitment
for the project.
I think we went through most of the stuff already in the previous approval. You all now know that this plan was set into motion by the legislature in 2015, and the policies that we're now complying with, the board adopted in 2017, and we're following it to a T. This area is not designed to be rural going forward. In the old days. And I again I understand and I appreciate before Connected City was created, there's a swath through
here that was AC and AG in the comp plan agricultural. But the board made the decision and the legislature made the decision that that was all gonna change, and all we're doing is fulfilling the mission that the board adopted now six six and a half years from. go on that. Um I'm going to turn it over to uh Joe Semeno with WRA and he'll describe a little bit more about the roadway conditions so you all can understand that we're trying and to make a big effort here
to be good to our neighbors and to try to provide reasonable transitions to them so we're not putting townhouse units right on top of them and that type of thing.
Uh I'm not sure which who is it from? I'm not sure that I've
seen it from
the October third.
Okay. Okay. We we've met several times over the years and and part of what Joe and I don't know if he's talking about drainage, but Joe will address drainage amongst the easy. It's a
whole laundry list of things.
Yeah, it's a function. Okay. I I haven't seen him, I'll have to review him. Not my
copy. Yeah, okay.
Has a tank.
Mm-hmm.
Good afternoon everyone. My name is Joe Simoneau with WRA Engineering. One two three six three Hampton Park Boulevard, Tampa, Florida. Three three six two four, I have not been sworn, so I need to be sworn. Please.
Yeah, there was a common.
All right.
Oh I see. It's not a laser pointer, it's a hand. Okay, what we're looking at right now is the Kenton extension through the through our project from south to north, looking north, it's along the eastern side of our project. What we're trying to demonstrate here is we obviously this is right out of the connected city um Typical sections where you have the 142-foot right-of-way. However, there's additional room for these utility easements and telecommunication easements on the east side. But also east of that,
existing Kenton, the dirt road there will remain, which has a 50-foot right-of-way. So what we're trying to demonstrate here, along with the 15-foot buffer, we're going to have have on the western side is we actually have a total of 237 feet between any potential lot line within our project and the existing lot lines to our east. That's the purpose of that cross section. Would you please change to the access, the following access? Yeah.
So while that's coming up, um, you know, we have a new Kenton Road extension. However, we have portions of the old Kenton Road that will remain as more or less reverse frontage roads. Um we can't blow out all those people's main roadway and construct this new extension, and we certainly can't have a whole bunch of driveways connecting to this collector road. So what we're showing here, this is the uh extension. Extreme southeast corner of our MPUD. And you can see right now, currently Kenton
takes a real hard 90-degree turn and a real hard 90-degree turn. So not real feasible, sustainable for any sort of you know long-term traffic or increased traffic over what's there now. So what you're seeing is the Kenton extension going right through there. Coming up into our MPUD and this is just an initial concept we did just to show how it can link to existing Kenton on the east side and existing Kenton on the west side. Obviously lots of engineering design needs to happen here, lots of review, but we just want to show you
that we're giving this a lot of thought. We're not just blowing through existing Kenton, not thinking what we're gonna do on either side of it. And then finally, uh which Please turn to the last slide, the drainage one.
And this one's real important because I know there's a lot of very valid concerns about King Lake. So we pull that up.
Well while she's pulling that up. Oh, there we go. Great. So um what we've got here, what we've got here is in this outline in blue, that's our MPUD. Uh 125 acres plus or minus King Lake over here to the east. King Lake floods. We all know that. It's a very valid concern. It exists in a bowl, you know, no less than 500 acres from the north drain into it, no less than 700 acres drain from the south into it. We're on the west side of it. And luckily
for our project and luckily for the neighbors, there is a major watershed divide that falls along this yellow line here. King Lake uh lives in Bayou Branch watershed, and then we live in Middle Cypress Creek watershed. So I know when it gets into drainage concerns, you know, you can go down a long rabbit hole of impervious surface, flood attenuation. CN values. This is just good old-fashioned gravity. We are not in the King Lake Bowl. We are on the west side
of the rim of the King Lake Bowl. We are anywhere from two to ten feet lower than this drainage divide, and our site simply does not drain east and uphill and overtop this watershed and go into King Lake. Coincidentally, when King Lake does fill up, It drains this way, actually, through our project. So we've talked to the residents and listened to again their valid concerns about us potentially blocking that very critical discharge. We know it's there, we know how important it is, it's the lifeline
to King Lake. It will be reviewed by multiple agencies that we have adequate conveyance going through there. And I'd like to point out that currently that's an unmaintained farm ditch. So how well that drains basically depends on how well the pasture is being maintained in any given part of the season when it rains. Well we're now going to have fully main we can't can't trim the wetland, however all the common areas of that flood plain going through there that we can't touch because of floodplain compensation will be maintained now. Those are those
three items. Thank you very much for your time.
Thank you.
Uh Clark Hovey again for the record. So I you know, again, there's been a lot of discussion with staff about the density of the project and the requirements of the Connected City Comprehensive Plan stuff. And you know, I think what we should do here is we should let the residents speak and I will respond to as many of their questions as I can. Okay. But I've asked Brad if he would respond and give a little bit deeper dive into staff. Thoughts about the density and what should be happening on the site because I think it would behoove Planning Commission to understand
that. Alright, and you have one Mr. Brad coming up now.
But yeah, I think that would be good.
Good afternoon, Brad Tippin, Planning and Development. Uh some of you have probably heard this before. Um, but Connecticut is is one of those uh somewhat unusual uh areas uh because it is uh currently fairly rural, uh but it is by statute uh legislatively intended to be more dense. This was identified regionally, uh the greater Tampa Bay area as a location uh where this type of development should happen. So there were steps put in place to get us there. One of the things that has to happen to make it
a viable area is you have to have a certain level of density. But what we did not want to do was just come in and and destroy uh some of those those rural patterns that were there. So what you'd see if you look at a larger picture, you see where we are now in Dade City and moving towards the interstate. The interstate is the highest density our highest intensity element in the area, right? So over here in Dade City we're fairly low. So we go across the countryside line on this side of the villages of Pasina Hills. Then you go into the the villages
and their separators as you approach Curley, right? Then when you get to Curley you're in the lower density single family housing which is a little step up and then as you're moving across and you're moving further To the west, the density goes up until you get to the urban core, and the higher density and higher intensity uses that are actually up against the interstate. So that's kind of that flow and that blend that we are seeking with that. With that in mind, there are a lot of multifamily involved in Connect the City, and they're mainly pushed
towards this edge to create that workforce in close proximity to the the jobs that are coming. That's basically the concept.
Okay. Any questions for Brad? No? Okay, thank you very much.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman we do have several folks that have signed up to speak on this item. Okay. I'm gonna call a first person Michael Halterack.
Good afternoon, board. My name is Michael Pultoric. Address is [address removed]. My farm is directly across the street from this project.
This is the first time in five days I've been out of bed, so please bear with me. Um
Since there was no public planning meeting for this amendment and since this was just posted while the real estate signs were still back on the road, I would like to ask for additional time for comments. We've had record low rainfall for the last year. We're in a drought. It's gonna be talked about, but I've moved my dock up into my back pasture and I launch my boat and I drive it 245 feet. feet before I get to my rear cattle fence. And I successfully drive my boat over the four foot
cattle fence to get into King Lake. That's how flooded it is. I'm sure you'll hear about that. But what I'd like to talk to you about is the traffic. Could you put that picture back up please with the uh the road if I pass out I apologize it's 'cause I've been sick.
Your picture is here on the road.
The one that was up there. That was my picture. Yeah. Can you put it back up please? Thank you.
So the master plan that you were shown earlier by all parties showed that Kenton Road is going to be a major artery. Major artery means it's going to be four paved lanes, two in each direction. Okay? Since we all met in April of 22. When we were brought in for a workshop later in the year after we were working with all parties to accommodate 270 something townhouses, because I would like to remind you this is the first step from single family into higher density. In my world, that means that it goes to duplexes,
potentially townhouses, not straight out.
Just let them get a chance to get get where they're.
Apologize for that.
Okay. Um by the way, this looks like one lane in each direction, not two lanes.
Absolutely, thank you, sir. We've been given a lot of fantasy in the last couple of proposals here. I would have loved to stand up and talk about. But this major artery when we came back for the workshop was already reduced to two lanes, one in each direction. That's where I'd like to go with this. The planned amendment here that we've all been forced. Horse-fed is the first step off of single-family residentials. We were working with all parties trying to find accommodations when it was 270-something townhouses. We would have been fine with duplexes or townhouses. We're
not being given 800 multifamily, and if you look at the master plan that none of us have been shown, but they have it. There's 400 driveways for townhouses. There's an addition. 350 high density apartments on this piece of property. That is not a one-step into higher density. That is shoving it down our back. Alright? Our land's being stolen from behind us because of flooding. But this is a bigger issue. This is the main artery that's gonna take the already approved 527 homes
and 106,000 commercial square feet on Kenton Road, 1,027 years. units of traffic each morning and afternoon, as well as this eight hundred plus an industrial site on the same complex, which will generate thirteen hundred mobile units morning and evening for peak delivery. That's 2,400 units going down those two roads. DOT, I have it, the absolute top you can
put on a two-lane road with a stop sign at the end of the road is 450 units per hour. That means that if everybody decided to go to work or take their kids to school, because since they're gonna have to go to charter schools, they can't get on buses, it would take four hours for everybody to get to work or take their kids to school in the morning or get home in the afternoon. This is not feasible. This does not work with what's being amended. What was amended was already from
a situation that was a higher step up than what it should have been. And the infrastructure we are being given does not support with schools, with stormwater, with traffic, with any of the infrastructure, any of these amendments. It does not accommodate our children for school. No. Unless you're willing to drive your child to school, you can't go to a charter school. There's no buses for that. So the Kirkland Ranch is great. That's miles down the road. You're trying
to alleviate driving your children to
school.
That's the whole point. There's not enough buses, drive your kid to school. Well if they have to drive four miles through this to get to the school and then back to walk to work, that didn't solve any problems. That made 'em worse. We can't golf cart across Curly Road, you'll get killed. We need your help. This needs to be shut down. This is non-negotiable. And the industrial site that's on this amendment does not work for anybody. It's in your own website. It's in your own rules
for the Pasco Ready Sites program. That every Ready Site program will be industrial capable and ready and will be fast uh amended for the zoning for any industrial application wanted. Trafficking is an issue in this country. We do not need transport vehicles and semis coming through our residential neighborhoods at at light to pick up our children and drive them a thousand miles down the road to
drop them off somewhere. Well this is about more than just How close we can live to work. This is about families and safety. We cannot forget that. And if they don't live here yet, we can tell them no. Okay? They're coming to our neighborhood. We all live here. We all are going to continue to live here. We have to take care of each other. We have to look out for each other. I'm not crying about development. Bring them, bring 277 duplexes. That's fine, they can be my neighbors.
their kids can come feed my cows. I don't care. We welcome them all. But they have to have schools to put their kids in that they don't have to drive four or five miles to get to. They have to be able to get to work in the morning without leaving at five AM. You can't see your kid off to school or to the bus stop if you have to leave two hours before traffic happens.
Well I thank you for your presentation. I I tried to give you quite a bit of extra time. I appreciate that question. And uh I want to make sure I get everybody in though.
And if there's any questions for me,
I appreciate your passion and your comments. Yeah. Thank you very much.
Mr. Chairman next person is Jim Marineri and that they that person will be followed by Roger Mendoza and then Kayla Mendoza.
Good almost evening. Uh Jim Marinary already sworn sworn in. Um I just wanted to address a couple of things and and the gentleman before me just did uh a little bit, but there's been several comments about where'd you come from, where'd you live. I've been born and raised here, whatever. Originally from Philadelphia, came down thirty years ago, lived in Pasco County for twenty-six. Um I purchased the property I have now, I previously was was across the interstate, but I po purchased
it for the the texture of the zoning that Pasco County had approved, including the master plan that was updated in the early two thousands, I believe. Um and Everyone knows you're going to have the development. This Kenton Road development? 800, I don't think they're gonna put eight hundred. I'm crossing my fingers. It's probab they're probably gonna come and say, you know, four hundred. That's still a lot. But
going back to my previous um uh the previous uh project The road system isn't capable of handling it. from my perspective on Elam Row. because until that Kenton Road extension goes from Elon Road to Overpass, like it was supposed to have done when Epperson was was built. It was in the plants. But it wasn't done. I don't know why, I don't know
how, but that is a key part of that arterial highway. Elam is supposed to be an intermediate. Passage until that stuff gets done, until the roadway improvements are done, until Kenton is connected. Uh and that is the first I saw that. A two-lane. It's supposed to be four. I understand they get credits if they build two, and then the state or the county will finish it up at some point in the future, which is the whole point of this. When?
How long? The schools being built.
it's not feasible to go from one place to the other. I mean, I don't know about you, but I I lived two miles from my school and I walked. I was able to walk. Um I took the bus when it was raining. That isn't an option. for the majority of the folks who live up here and it is being i uh the options are decreasing by the day. Um I believe that
The project's going to go through. I think a condition of it should be the completion of that road through from Elam to to Overpass. It's going to cause, in connection with the other, other development down there, it's going to be a nightmare for a long, long, long, long time.
Thank you. Thank you.
Roger Mendoza.
Hello. I have my daughter here with me as well. She's Kayla. Is there s uh a few things I need to show?
Gayla, welcome. Glad you could join us.
Welcome to your civics lesson.
Or it might be ours.
Everyone, my name is uh Rod Mendoza. I am [address removed] in Wesley Chapel. I am uh the property north or north of boundary of the the Foss Trust property that's being sold. I I'm here to talk about more concerns in regards to the development of the father trust which is directly north of the development of our property, like I said. Uh density is one of the things that we are concerned about. Original plan like was mentioned is 250 homes. 250,
275 homes or so. Right now eight hundred of course is is a lot, right? Of course I saw the the actual thing where it says the apartments on top and a possible multi-faction. Family bios, right? There is uh the boundary is really close to our boundary. Uh I don't know if you have show this really quick.
This one has this one shows the boundary, basically our view. Right here, this guy right here. This one shows the boundary of where the retention pod and everything else is gonna be. This right here is.
Sir, I'm sorry, but if you have to speak, you'll have to speak from the microphone
over there because the clerk can't pick you up. I have to make a recording of it.
Alright, so that little dot right there is our tree. Do you see it? And that tree behind it, do you see that big picture behind it? The other picture, because I want to say our view. That little dot right there. Oh, we have a Right.
This little dot right here is our tree that's right here behind us. About 410 feet or so of retention pond space. That's gonna be right here among us. That little dot right here is my house, you see it? That little dot. What I wanted you guys to understand is that my wife also and I also run a uh it's called Nature's Haven of Florida, it's a nonprofit out of our home and we
I'm sorry, could you just speak a little bit?
It's called Nature's Haven of Florida. Mm-hmm from our it's a nonprofit that we run out of our home and it's basically dealing with people with kids with special needs, autism, spec kids on the spectrum, kids with auditory issues, kids that run, kids that like
Yeah. So we're thinking of something that will help us in regards to blocking that area off as well. Not only that, but flooding retention uh in regards to how big that retention pond is. If you look at this small portion of Kenton Road right here, this is three times the amount. It's three times. It's big. Humongous. You see that? Kenton Road, if that's 150 feet, that's 410 feet. That's humongous compared to my area. I do have Have an underwriter looking
into my insurance to see if that particular spot is gonna raise my insurance as well. So I don't know if that's a concern as well. Uh, one of the other things that we also want is also visual privacy. We have uh donkeys and cows in the back as well, because right here in the back we will have donkeys and uh not only that, but we have boars, not our boars, but wild boars. Have uh bobcats that we've seen, coyotes. So, concerns in regards to the liability of these people right here coming onto
our property. Not only that, but we have uh recording from here, it's a private road down to Elan. So when he was talking about stormwater and the entrance up here, that's something that we're concerned about because we were told that it was gonna be a dead-ended, like literally the Pasco. County scrapers don't come past us. They don't scrape our route. They literally stop at our end. So for them saying that we have an entrance here and an entrance down there on Elam, that's not what we were
talking about. We talked about dead ending or a roundabout and then one entrance, one entrance back and forth between all our private roads from here down to Elam. Not only that, but the capacity of everybody that's gonna be coming all the way up to Kenton Road and Murata. Literally Kenton Road goes right into the lagoon of Murata. You guys know that? No. It goes right into the lagoon, the Murata. So Kenton Road is a direct access, and as Mike
was saying, if we have only two lanes, just imagine the capacity. Density that's coming through. Not only stormwater, etc., etc. You guys heard it all as well, as school capacity, right? School capacity is a thing. So if we're counting in regards to how our density level is, not only this part, but up here, I know there's the apartments that we're talking about, that the density of 800 is going to be uh something that is gonna be really hard for uh not only us but for our uh nonprofits. As well.
Okay.
So I'm thinking I'm asking for infrastructure to be looked at first prior to any of this being of concern for any couple development. I understand it's part of the the CC and P E D structure, but uh something has to be looked at for not only I understand there's residents coming in and going and living here, but we also have to look for the residents that are already here. You know what I mean? So it's one thing that we also want to do. Okay.
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay. Um hello, I'm Kayla Mendoza, daughter of Carolyn and Roger Mendoza. Um And my dad talked about all the things that we um we are afraid to like happen. But one of the main things that I'm afraid to happen is the wildlife that is in the section that we are discussing. And so some of the things I go outside every day, I have thirty chickens, I take care of them, they love me, um I see animals like every day, every time I s I go outside,
so I'm afraid that if we if you if the development happens and I don't know what would happen to the animals. So like there's a lot of animals I see outside, like lots of snakes, black racers, eastern rat snake, corn snake, diamond black rattlesnake, um diamond back rattlesnake, um king snakes, garter snakes, cotton mouse, coral snakes. And also a lot of birds too from the where the le the wetlands are and from where our in like in our forest back area. There's like the green heron, the
cattle egret, the snowy egrets, the sandal cranes, the gray egrets, the white-eyed bis, the rosy spoonbills, the little blue herons, the wood storks, the mo the bot modeled ducks, the mylers, the limpins, the glossy. Okay, this is the red-shoulder hocks. the short-tailed hawks, the red-winged blackbirds, eastern bluebirds, florida scrub jays, blue jays, it goes on. And it's not all animals, it's not all birds, it's not all snakes. It's also the animals that
live there. Like my dad mentioned, there's bobcats, there's like coyotes, but there's also rabbits. We have cottontails, swamp rabbits, marsh rabbits. have flying squirrels that live in our backyard actually saved two before. from like mutant and stuff. We also have like um other fox like the gray fox. We also have um annoles which are a type of lizards. We also have deer, we have deer back there. We also have gopher tortoises. We also
have Florida Panthers sometimes like the I don't know if they're like here or not. They're probably somewhere. Out of all these that I've said, ten of these are threatened, there's fifteen that are endangered. There's more than twenty that are declining in population, and twenty-two of these are protected. I want to know how you I want to know how the pre how you would protect these from after the development starts happening. I want to know how they are, how they get to their new home, how to protect
them because If the development happens, these animals sometimes not good, sometimes they are, but they will come to our property because their their habitat is being lost, and so they'll come into our property in their popularity, like because since since these houses are gonna be danced together, and it's like them, they're gonna be danced together like as if they lived in the subdivision. but it's their stuff position. So I wanna know how you're good at save money.
Okay, thank you very much. We will try to get some answers for you when uh uh the applicant comes back up.
Mr. Chair, next person is David Torino, followed by Jim Hendry.
I
I I live at [address removed]. Uh
You David?
I'm
David. Okay.
I talked to the commissioners before.
And you've been sworn, David? David, you've been sworn or no?
I was talked to by the commissioners before the episode man started. I was told by one of the commissioners, I would never see a drop of water on my property. I haven't seen my property for eight years. I've been flooded for eight years. We should be two and a half feet low. We're two and a half feet high. My walkway's destroyed. I had seven hundred and thirty feet of walkway completely destroyed. By water. that I wasn't even supposed to
see a drug. I had another commissioner come out to my house, Oakley. Said, man. Somebody dropped the ball. No one's doing anything. No one's doing anything. Now you're talking about developing another place across the road from me. Sure, the water runs that way. But the water's got perk. You're gonna have 5,200 and some square yards of of uh pavement over there? Where's the water going?
You guys gotta think about what you're doing. You're killing us out there. You're killing me. My land, I can't see it anymore. I can't even get to the lake to fish any more. It's not right. It's not right what you're doing. Somebody's gotta control something here.
That's my Mike Brian.
Okay, thank you.
He's next.
Jim Hendry followed by Carol Hendry.
I don't think I'm handry, but I I didn't sign up to see.
Oh okay. All right, Jim. Carol? No.
Okay. Somebody wrote your name down, I guess.
Someone wrote their names down.
Probably your wife did that.
Ah I gotcha, uh huh.
Next person's last name is Ball. I cannot tell what the
Okay.
Oh okay. Okay. Another person that got tricked, huh?
You don't have to unless you really want to.
My name is Kim. And I live next door with Saino. My property. is the water come out. On the King Lake. Excuse me, ma'am, can you state your address for reference to all these? Oh, okay.
You pull that microphone down a bit more for you.
Like [address removed]. We see chapel.
Okay.
That water when they came down
it will be flooded all that the developer that he's trying to do. half of the property, water is gonna come from the lake.
Mm-hmm.
And I worry. I live there.
fifty five years. Nice sea water. come the come up so high. Nobody gonna believe us that we've been telling that that water is not gonna what they're trying to do with that water It's gonna still come out weekly. We cut five pound bass on the rope. That's how high the water comes out.
Mm-hmm.
So before you all okay for them to do what they do, they had to come out something to protect all our property. We work very hard to earn the property. Thank you.
Okay. Thank you very much.
Next person is Annabelle Riles, followed by Bradley Riles.
So hello again. Um so for this development my main concern is um the Elam Road and the traffic, uh especially so for our neighbor your our neighborhood Lakeside estates. Um so this development's gonna be um at the corner of uh Elam and Kenton. So the increase in traffic um our neighborhood right before
the first entrance of our neighborhood from Elam and Canton. Uh there is a uh blind turn. uh that uh a lot of people go very fast on this turn and there is no signalisation or anything. So we would appreciate uh that uh there is you know like some kind of signal to signal that there is a blind turn uh so we don't you know get into accidents when we get out of the neighborhood. So that would be a a
good thing. So that's um that's about it. That's all I have to say for that.
Thank you. Good suggestion.
Y'all know me, I was here a minute ago, so I I don't really have anything more to say. Okay. Uh I just wish you'd reconsider about the lake access thing. Yeah, uh My neighbors and I, we've been putting all our bass back for years. Because we didn't want to take 'em. We would have took 'em if we wanna take.
I mean it's that simple. You know, we did the right thing and we did catch and release. And there's no guarantee that sixteen hundred people or all these strangers are gonna feel the same way. So it's not us being selfish. It's about us looking out for something that we care about. It was that simple. Yes, Brad Riles, three oh two, three one, all right. This has to go before
the
county I
was
up here earlier, so I thought I didn't have to be a little bit more.
This has to go before the county commission, so you'll have another another chance to talk about it. Appreciate it. Okay.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Next person is Tim Dolan and then the last person I have signed up for this item is Richard Lynch. All right.
Welcome back,
Mr. Dolan. Hello again. Um
Well this project is definitely um closer to me. I live right down the street on Tyndall and um I'm here to speak to a few issues concerning this project on behalf of two neighbors. Also, um Uh Dewey Atkinson at [address removed]. And Chris Abade at [address removed]. And um Uh again, it
seems like as per the first speaker, I think he did a great job in summarizing the issues that maybe the county didn't take the time to consider, the traffic down the road, the scope creep with Connected City, and the lack of um infrastructure. And again, that's what I've been saying. We're not getting the infrastructure in place. So with regard to this project, my concern is If you break ground on it, all these trucks, these construction trucks are going to be coming down Tendal to access that parcel. unless you
insist that Kent's completed first or whatever methods of access they're gonna use. But I'd ask for a condition. We had this before, we had the problem with Metro, where they had caravans of dump trucks coming coming down on dirt road tendril. They literally shook the foundations on my home. Uh, and I had to uh get in contact with them about three times to get them to back off on using Tendle as a shortcut. So My concern is and I'd like a condition here at it that they do not send
these the you know begin this construction by sending all these heavy earth movers and everything down Tyndall. It's a dirt road, it's not fair to us. And uh it can't bear that kind of traffic. Again, we had it before with those dump dump truck caravans and took a number of calls to get that resolved. So Uh I these guys haven't mentioned anything about uh the ownership of the the Kenton extension out of Mara and how they plan to acquire that. Do they have the land already for that? Is that gonna be a predecessor having
that completed, is that going to be a predecessor to any work that gets done? there. Um again that's our concerns, but there's no way you should be allowed to access that area to develop it, before That road is in place. Yeah. You know, as far as uh that's the one condition we're asking for is no uh none of these construction vehicles on Tyndall and secondarily, and I'll just get back to my original point. Uh that's a huge area of wetlands. I'm not sure it's properly depicted
here, but I thought that was the headwaters of Cyprus Cypress Creek potentially that flow out of out of King Lake. And I know these guys reference some fighting they're having on their end of King Lake, up by us though. We're about a foot and a half below where we should be right now, so And there's something there that needs to be looked at too, um, because we're having no such problems. As a matter of fact, it's been the lake's been lower this year for us than Any of the past ten years, I'll say. um at this time of year. So uh And
by the way, I've been here since ninety one.
Thank you, sir. Okay, thank you very much. And can we seriously look at that condition? Is that something you can consider and write into this project? So they don't start it prematurely by bringing their trucks down our dirt road to do the work?
I'll
address
that when we get
I'll address that when we get to the discussion because Oh when you mean the discussion at the end of this discussion? Well no, the the the county actually has a section of its land development code that's currently being applied not as it ever was intended, but was em was intended to address your exact concern. So it might be a great time to have that discussion. Definitely. Thank you. Thank you.
Last person is Richard Lynch.
Okay, Richard? Richard Lynch. He left?
Okay. Richard left.
Mr. Chairman I just wanted to also say that for the record, um someone by the name of Paul Grimshaw had signed up to speak on WebEx, but he is not on WebEx. Okay.
All right, very good. Um then that that being the case, let's have the applicant Back up to answer all these questions about water and road paving and all that kind of stuff.
Mr. Chairman Clorcabi again. I'm gonna answer a few of the questions and then turn this over on on some of this to the experts on our team who can better answer answer it. But I did want to say a couple of things. We did have a community meeting. Mr. Balzarac was at the community meeting and I've also met with him two or three other times in the last year after other hearings and projects. I understand he's concerned about the King. Lake level, but as Joe told you before, and I'm gonna ask that he reiterate, this project does not
discharge into the King Lake Basin at all. But Joe will bring that up. But I just wanted you to know we did have a community meeting, he was there. Most of the folks who spoke were there. We've talked with them. The MPUD entitlements have not changed in a year and a half. They're the exact same ones that we were there and that we talked about in a community meeting. Um all right. Let's see. Uh it Mr. Balzrak was also worried about there being industrial. The service ready site acreage on this project
only allows office entitlements. There's no industrial, no light, no heavy industrial, only office. So the only non-residential uses up on the service-ready site acreage as you're approaching the core. would be some retail or office as allowed. That's what site service ready site average allows on this site. Um then I did want to speak to Mr. Mendoza. Um we were trying to meet with him earlier today and I think we missed each other. Well we've had some emails with him. Uh
there's a few things that we will do for Mr. Mendoza. We understand he's got a I believe a special needs child and they've got some specialized facilities there. If you look at their property, the upland portion of the property where his house is is pretty much framed in by a wetland that spans almost all of the western end. I am comfortable my client will add a condition saying we will not have any units within two hundred feet of his house. And so we're happy to agree to that. So David if or if somebody's
taking notes, that's one thing we'll agree to that. We will also put any units that we have along our south boundary, we will have a fence of some sort. So we will provide some privacy through that. And we will also not take down the barbed wire fence that's along the property boundary because it sounds like he has donkeys and some other agricultural animals and we don't want to interfere with that, so we will not take that down. We'll leave that in place. We want to be a good neighbor, as I mentioned
before. And I I do want to say I I take the the flooding issues at King Lake seriously. Um Mrs. Ball who spoke I've spoken to several times, I believe it's her son who's a deputy sheriff, very nice young man, and we do are not diminishing it. We've looked at aerials and you can see the water is high up by their house. And my pledge to you after looking at this a lot is if I can get the county to cooperate with a larger culvert in the existing
Dirk Kenton Road, We're going to oversize with the county's assistance the new culvert that's going to go in the new Kenton Road. And we will channeli we'll clean out the channelized ditch on our site and I believe we'll end up W all we're gonna do is make their situation better. I'm not I'm not saying it's gonna solve everything at King Lake, but after talking with Joe, I believe we can do that and I believe we can help them. Um The last thing, you know, and and I don't know if John wants to get into this
now, but we certainly understand that if we have any construction access on a dirt road, we're going to have to water or spray the road to control the fugitive dust emission. We understand that and we're prepared to do that. Absolutely. That's what we're expected to do and we will do. Other than that, I'm gonna let let me have Steve talk to the Traffic issues first and then I'm gonna have Joe speak to the uh
Can I ask one quick question? Um so for Mr. M Mr. Mendoza's property on the concept plan it showed uh retention area kind of right across from his house. So I know that could potentially change as well. Um if there does end up being a retention area there, um what what would that buffering? Wall or or buffering area look like between these properties?
We typically wouldn't have you only generally put the buffers around where the units are. So we wouldn't want to have a fence around a pond, for instance. That just doesn't make a lot of sense. But we've looked at it enough to know that's really where the low area is in the southeast corner, and I'm telling you it's a very high likelihood that's where the pond's gonna be. So it's gonna be a sizable distance. from his house to any residential use.
So I think his concern was if you end up with a decent amount of water in there it could pose a safety hazard to uh some of his students there at his at his property. So like you know, is there um the possibility of putting some sort of a barrier between them to prevent them from accessing that?
Uh to having to go see that if we don't touch they have to go through a barbed wire fence first before we get there.
Yeah I I'm familiar with kids let me talk with my client see what we can do while Joe and Steve are talking. I'll see if they're right.
and uh study the about
yeah uh yeah yeah and I was uh Joe's Joe's gonna address that and and we actually got one thing I think that the Mendozas will like that Joe will address.
So Clark before you leave you made a statement about light industrial not being permitted I'm reading the permitted uses for service ready site but light industrial is a permitted use.
We only put office in ours though. That's all it says
Mm. Yeah I'm happy I I will agree to a condition. We're not going to be able to do that.
Okay. I didn't I didn't mean to. I I'm happy to say that we will eliminate any industrial uses within the service ready site acreage uses. That that's not an agenda.
So I also have a question about there's a list of uses that are attached to this agenda item Right. Which may be causing part of the confusion. Um it's after the loom. I don't know who generated that list of uses. But it's not accurate for many reasons.
Okay, let me work on that because I'm not sure it it may not even be the latest loom. So let me look at it. It's not
the loom. The
loom
doesn't deliver
something attached to the loom.
There's an attachment to the loom that's got a whole laundry list of uses. And it some of them says they're prohibited, some of them says they're limited. And so for example, what's not shown as limited or prohibited is light industrial. It's got auto dealerships as being allowed, which that the code doesn't even allow because the only retail you get is if it's in an accessory use in a bill. Yeah, I need to look at that data. My point is I don't even know why this list is in I in the agenda package.
Gavin, do you know? Does anybody know why this list 'cause it it's very confusing to me because it it implies that there's uses permitted in this M PUD that
probably are not permitted. Yeah, so when we created the condition we had that um all the uses in five point two the I don't know the exact section um but I included that chart just to kind of outline what is and what isn't allowed.
Okay,
but it's not accurate because
some of these uses like the retail uses are only allowed as an accessory use to a multi-use building if you read the code. So you could never get an all auto dealership. as an accessory use to in a multi use I mean I think that would be almost I guess it's theoretically possible, but unlikely that you could put an auto dealership as an accessory use into multi-use building. So
My recommendation would be that you just strike this whole exhibit and Reference back to the code. If Clark wants to limit it the code further and not allow industrial, I that's his prerogative. But I d I think it's misleading to put this exhibit. That's why I asked you put it.
That was me, yeah, yeah. That was meant to be an additional
resource to I think you need to get rid of it 'cause it's misleading and probably not accurate.
That's fine. I can do that. That's
no problem.
But in terms of the condition, Clark, you pr if you don't want to allow land industrial you need to have language that says that.
Good afternoon. Steve Henry, Linkson Associates, 5023 West Laurel, Tampa 33607, and I have been sworn. I just want to address the traffic real quick. Um from a traffic standpoint, as y'all know, the the way Connected City works is we're building the master roadway system incrementally. And so what we use to do this is we actually use beyond any other area in the county, we use a twenty forty-five model. So we start with that and then look at what roadways and what the impact is as we build these roads incrementally.
And so we've looked at this road, we've actually added in the April development that's to our south plus ours to look at making sure that the roadway will have adequate capacity as a two-lane divided roadway, which according to the analysis it it will operate. So from that standpoint, we actually do more than any area area in the county as far as looking at transportation, looking at the infrastructure. And also what what I've actually just heard today was that part of the code is that there's a monitoring requirement, again, unlike any other area in the county Connected C
has a monitoring requirement. And so now the county has hired a consultant to actually monitor to make sure that in fact what was in the original analysis that we're not exceeding the 1.2 BC ratio for every roadway. So there's added protection. One, we're doing a 2045 model, two, that you've got that added protection. If you've got a a consultant, an independent consultant that is reviewing and looking at these the the VC ratio to make sure that if one of those exceeds it, we gotta come up with some improvements to allow it alone to continue
in connected SIP.
Uh question for you, Steve. So uh I'm showing it's a hundred and forty two feet of right-of-way for Kenton. Correct. Yes. Um so is that sufficient to add another travel lane in each direction?
Right. So wait the way the way it's set up in the master roadway plan is every roadway is set up when it's a four lane divided, it's called phase one. So what that is is phase one. So what we've done is we built the outside two lanes of the ultimate four lane road. So that y that's why you'll see that median is so wide. So what'll happen now is as they come in to build the next you know, if it needs to be four lanes, they just build it on interior. So all the drainage has already been designed, all the piping system has been designed and built. So it's real easy to come in and just build those other two lanes in the future, as
opposed to just building i in a standard two lane road than having to go tear it up and build a four-lane. So it's all Set up so that it incrementally can be built and expanded.
So how is construction gonna access the site?
That would be a question I but I haven't looked at that from that standpoint. So but I know that the the what what likelihood is that is that at least at this point in time that the April par partial to the south would likely build first, which would then access from Elam as they build the road north. This partial would build from where uh the April Porcel stops their northern access and build north. So likely they would access it through um
Kenton Road and just continue that construction north as they go. But we haven't looked specifically with hands have been right with
Okay, so I I was just told that the right-of-way has already been dedicated for the new Kenton Road from Elam North. So so we have access to this property to be able to build that.
Correct. They won't use Tendal.
I I'll have to let the the developer commit to that. But that's the more likely.
Well I think that's what we need to know. I think that's a good thing.
Steve,
did you Look at the intersection of Pelam and Kenton.
Yes,
we did it. So with the project traffic is it still functioning
correct. Yes, it's still functioning adequate. Now we are putting turn lane well the the um uh April Proxel is putting you know turn lanes at that intersection. Yes, it will still operate acceptable level service with this project and with the the Aprilly project.
Okay, so there Purley is making improvements to that intersection. Yes. Okay.
Steve the the right-of-way for Kenton is from Elam down to Overpass.
Well th that road that right-of-way has already been dedicated. That was done as a part of the Epperson project. What we're talking about is from Elam
North. Is there anybody and this might be a question for the county, but is there anybody that can speak to the status of the construction of that missing leg?
To my knowledge, there's nobody that's on the on the hook to to build that that portion
of it. So who's gonna be responsible for that? The county?
Potentially now and and David can explain it but probably better than I can. But the way Connected City is also set up is that there are monies that are set aside for segments of roadway that n may not get built at at at times or signals to be put in that the county then uses that money to build those segments. So it's actually s in the financial plan to have that money to be able to build those seconds. So that may it may be that if a developer doesn't do it, that the county would have the money from Connected City to be able to build those
seconds.
It just seems to me that if the developer wants to develop a a a development there, provide an adequate road to get to it.
Well we and we've got the Elam, but yes, correct. It i there is a missing segment from Elam to Oak Pass.
Yeah, so then he's gonna put the burden on the county to do it.
Well again it it part of part of the financial plan is setting aside money because there's going to be segments of roadway that that don't get built by you know all developers.
Because this was going on at the time that was drafted, and instead we're using that to extract a thousand dollars and two thousand dollars here that we never use to improve. approve a road, but that was the exact purpose of that ordinance and that was exactly what I was going to address and that was specifically going along happening with construction access. That's why that section of the code is in place.
Yeah, that's that that part concerns me too.
I think planning and development. Uh I want to address two things. One is construction access. I agree, construction access is always touchy, especially when you have dirt roads. Uh but these projects do tend to come in in phases uh when you get to those construction plans, uh smaller chunks, and until we know at that site plan stage which chunks are coming in and where we it's kind of premature to make some very specific requests.
Substandard road section of the code that was drafted to address this very issue. So
Connecticut is actually set up a little differently than the rest of the county in the way that the financial plan addresses that a developer can uh build an extension of a road beyond what they require uh or build it to a a width, four lanes instead of two beyond what they require, uh and the financial plan reimburses them with credits. So it it's it's actually set up to do this. So either way, whether it's a county burden to build the road, it it still ultimately comes out of that same pot of money. It's the same uh same stuff. It was set up that way
in the financial plan. Uh so it it's really a matter of where the traffic flow goes and with what timing related to the timing and phasing, uh which is what I think Steve was speaking to. Uh so that's it's it's just I want to clarify that it's set up a little bit differently than a lot of the other projects that you've seen in the county.
Right, I think the question though is will Elam and Kenton function without that missing link to overpass? And do our traffic engineers agree that Because we have no idea when the county will get around to building the missing piece of Kenton to overpass. To our topic people agree that Helam and Kenton will function without that missing link.
So I I believe that's my understanding and the timing we do have Essen Khalil on here that can likely speak to that. I'm not sure if he would be speaking for someone else on his team, but timing and phasing would have a job, actually this is a Connected City Transportation Plan. A little bit different than a timing and phasing to see Rick in the county, but um uh it would address that type of issue and look at that timing to see when that happens and if it is ultimately triggered when it's triggered those additional lanes or additional connections have to be made.
Well I mean there's no condition I'm assuming they said it was okay 'cause they didn't impose a condition requiring that missing link to be built. Correct. But that means they must so that they did conclude that Elemon will function fine without that missing link?
So the question is the the the missing link between of Kenton between Elam and Overpass.
If that is not built, Will Elam function at an acceptable level of service?
Yes, yes it will. And based on based on analysis, based on the model, we our the model did not include that because again what we're doing is we're using the the 2045 SC data and we're looking at the the network that is going to be built with the projects that are either funded or already in place. So that segment was not included in the model. model pointer analysis.
And do you remember the local service of Elam when
It it will operate except the level of service users.
What level?
The V C ratio is that that's what we're looking at here is the it's a V C uh I'd say
PC ratio is for Elum is around um point five six.
Sounds like a level of service C,
right? D C somewhere in there.
Well in the grand scheme of things that's not that bad. Correct.
Connected cities one point two.
Steve, is it is it addressed any I guess th this project relies on the April project building a section of Kenton as well, right? Sure. I is there anything I mean, is there a chance this project comes in before the April project? So the southern section of Kenton. Early
access is is Kenton is Kenton to the south. So they they i i if a preliminary doesn't build it, they gotta build it. That that's their only access.
The this developer has to build it? It's g that road's gotta be there. Yes. In which case they would get credits out of the connected city?
Not not for the first two lengths.
Oh. Okay. Okay, so But yeah there is a lot of things.
So if there
is
if the if the road's constructed to accommodate four lanes, why don't they just put four lanes in?
Well and in fact one of the things and we actually were speaking I don't even know if the the the county engineers on the phone or on the line but one of his things is he doesn't want those roadways built to four lanes if it's not needed because now you're spending county funds to build roads prematurely. So the idea is to build them when they're needed and that's part of the analysis that we do and then also some of the monitoring that
you
can do.
Pardon? Think they're gonna get cheaper in the future?
No, no, they're definitely not getting cheaper in the future, but I'm quite sure I buy that
logic.
A after my discussion with the county engineer, um it's my understanding that his his concern was that we we may be prematurely spending too much on certain roads when there are immediate needs on other roads that he would like to use used those funds for. So he didn't want to Do it in that order. That was that was his
advantage. Therein lies the entire problem with our roadway network throughout the county. But
I I don't know if you'll convince the residents too if you want to stand up back there that that's that's four lanes aren't needed there right now either.
I was hoping we might bring up Joe Simoneau to answer a couple of the other questions in the that the
neighborhood.
Yeah,
please do. But I think we're still thinking about that roadway situation.
Well but I mean I just wanna say again for that We are satisfying the level of service requirements and that's exactly what we're required to do. We're not required to build four when two works. And that's that's what the financial plan says. That's what the master roadway plan says. So I think that's the answer here.
Well, Clark, do you know the answer on the construction traffic about whether there's any chance it's gonna use that you would be using
I mean I uh honestly I'm a little bit reluctant to s to say my only concern is I expect that our neighbors to the south of Prilly are gonna be under construction sooner rather than later. As you know they have an approved development agreement and they're going to start at some point. I would hope we'd be going through their site because again the right-of-way is in place there. I just I don't quite know. I mean there's a lot of what ifs. I hate to say that I wouldn't use some other existing county right-of-way. And just
so everyone's clear, there are other sections of Tyndall Row, it's not all dirt. I mean there's a considerable portion that's been built west from Curley and there's another section that's been that's about to be built pursuant to another MPUD. So I I'm reluctant to say we won't use a road that may be three quarters built at the time. I there's a lot of unknowns.
I mean there there are rules that we have to follow when we have construction traffic on that kind of roadway, as John I think was alluding to. We have to water and we have to do all these things. You're supposed to do a pre construction survey of the road and if you beat the road up you have to you have to come in and regrade it and all that kind of stuff and we have no problem following those requirements if we even use it. So anyway, I I do want Joe to speak
Thank you, Lark. Um Hello again. Um just reiterating once again this project's in a different watershed than King Lake. Um we we understand how bad the drainage problems are in King Lake. There's no possible way for us to exacerbate it. Being on the other side of the watershed divide, that said, if Swift Mud in the County decide to upgrade that culvert under Kent Road, we can accommodate the additional flow. So we can help water get out of Kentucking Lake Basin faster and help these folks. But as as an engineer
we can't change that. It would take Swift Mud in the County to upsize the culvert under Kent Road. But if you choose to do so, we can accommodate that additional flow through our project. So that's a good thing. Mr. Mendoza mentioned the Pond being close to his house. In terms of a flooding standpoint, I just looked at the County LIDAR. His house sits up around elevation 109. That pond will be going in a location that's at about elevation 105, 4 feet lower. It would be discharged into a wetland system that's about 103. So, you know, six
feet lower, and from there it just drops and drops and drops. So all water is moving away from him. I would like to to address the environmental concerns. Um I do have to say uh that was very impressive, Ms. Mendoza. Uh I I still sometimes get nervous up here. I get a little shaky voice sometimes and intimidated and you didn't even stutter. So very, very good job. Um what I would like to do, um, our firm has a whole environmental component to it. Uh yeah, Mr. Mendoza, with your permission, I'd like to get our Director of
Environmental Services in touch with you and your daughter and explain the um the permitting environmental surveys that need to be done on Go for tortoises, all sorts of threatened endangered species. And then because there's a long gap between those studies and when construction starts, there's pre-construction surveys that need to be done again. And if anything is found, there's relocation protocol for certain threatened and endangered species, and there's nesting season protocols that if there's certain species in certain places of the construction during construction
initiation. you have to completely avoid those and monitor them throughout the nesting season. So it's actually it's very interesting and again with your permission, sir, I'd be happy to get our Director of Environmental Services in touch with you guys and explain every step of the way.
That's a good suggestion.
Yeah.
And uh this clerk I'll begin. I did speak with Mr. Mendoza and he agreed that he'd meet with us before County Commission to talk about the condition next to his house. We understand the sensitivity there and again we want to be a good neighbor. Okay. So I'm if there are not any other questions, what I was gonna do was try to restate, I believe, these additional conditions we've been talking about. Just I don't know if we've gotten them all down. I thought it would be helpful. Um the first was that we said we would have no
residential units within two hundred feet of the Mendoza house. Right. We said that any units that we have along the southern boundary of the MPUD would have a fence. On the south side of them.
Uh just let me just interrupt you because we're talking about n next to Mendoza. Right. Yeah, he's he owns the property. That's right, next to the Mendoza. I j I just think it's important, uh Clark, because I'm very familiar with uh um you know, those c conditions of those ch children might need runs the school for kids like that. Yeah, and they'll go right through an open fence. So you gotta have a you gotta have a solid fence. U
I
under understood. Uh well they'll be in that lake.
So Clark, I don't I don't I don't understand the condition though. You're saying you won't have any homes within two hundred feet.
But even even even west so I wish we somebody could pull the aerial up. West of their house there's a large wetland system, so I'm assuming they're not going through on through the wetland system. But we will have units that would be north of that area, but just for visual protection, we were gonna put fencing along the residential areas there so that he wouldn't hopefully be able to see our units as easily. That was that was the thought about that.
I'm not sure that's his main concern, but uh
I I know. He's he's also concerned about what happens between the barbed wire fence and the pond, and that's what I told him we were gonna meet about and he agrees we're gonna meet about and try to figure out what to do in that area. Okay. But I'm just trying to also get the other conditions out because we also did agree that we would leave the existing barbed wire fence up because again he does have livestock and stuff like that and I need to make sure they don't get out. And then the final one that I think I got w was saying that we will not have any industrial
uses right in the service ready site acreage.
Uh uh.
With that our I mean our
team. Did you want to state it like uh like that as in we're not gonna have any industrial uses versus stating it is it's limited to office?
Well it it allows office and some accessory retail and if I think if I say no industrial it will be easy for us to go back and strike through the industrial codes. If I left those in there I I didn't mean to long ago We decided we were only gonna have Office and the support retail in there and and I probably screwed that up.
Right, right. And that code section allows like that.
I understand. So we'll we'll come up with some language with David to make it very clear that that that will not be allowed.
And Clark, just to Get it straight in my head. So if a prelie doesn't come in and they don't fulfill their obligations again, you're gonna build Kenton all the way from We would
have to yes, we would have to build
to your northern property
boundary? Right. Yeah. Okay.
Hi Brad Tippin again, planning and development. I just wanted to uh speak briefly about the service ready site acreage. Um we tend to want that to be reserved for things like target business uses and and whatnot. So when we overly restrict the uses that are there, it really limits the marketability of those sites. Those sites are designed almost like a pad ready site, but something that PEDC would do. Um and and we really want to try to to keep those open and I think the county is very comfortable restricting
uses uh such as industrial that it may not make sense in an area, that particular area, uh but we don't want to overly restrict those uses too far. So saying only office or or something like that may be too much that that we could we really wouldn't want to go with. Yeah, frankly I think that that's what travel
but I think that they're taking with uh construction of
I I appreciate what Dad Brad Dad's getting late and call him Brad Dad.
Yeah.
Lord help us all. You gotta die the bureaucrats. The bureaucrats are taking over my mind, man. Some of us know your dad. Brad's not your dad. No, he no he isn't. Um but I I I appreciate what Brad is saying, but that was not our intent and they're the sizing of the parcels up there will not lend itself to industrial uses anyway, and I don't think our neighbors want it. And I'm okay with saying that and I appreciate Brad's perspective, but I don't think this is the right place for that
this in this particular circumstance for industrial. Yeah.
All right. I want to be clear though to Brad's point. Heavy industrial is not allowed at all. I think what we're talking about is light industrial. But but I still get Clark's point if they want a strict light industrial. But I don't want anybody to think that we're allowing a concrete plant on these sites. These are light industrial manufacturing type buildings. But that being said we might have the right acres here. Right. So
and we're not speaking of of target industry, I was speaking kind of generally but things like pharmaceutical types of businesses, medical, d those types of things that we want to allow there that may not be able to go into certain clouds.
There's certain there's certain users and I'll give an example, like a Metler Toledo, okay, they're doing man they're doing some manufacturing in that building But uh from all outward appearances that just looks like a big office building. So but it might be considered light industrial because they're making machinery in there. Assembly. So but the out the public would never know that that's what's occurring in there. So my point is that not all light industrial uses are scary. I'm just this is a informational educational statement. Then but that being said,
if Clark wants to restrict light industrial on this site, I I'm not opposed to it.
Unless there are any other questions I'd ask that you close the public comment and proceed. Okay.
I I'm sorry, sir. We can't bring up people I can't keep bringing people up time and time again.
Yeah, there'll be another chance.
Okay. Uh well we've heard all the testimony, so it's time to make a decision.
It's um straight.
Well so in the interest of moving this forward, can can we get first get a motion to add the additional conditions that Clark just read into the record? I mean I don't I'm not saying you need to approve it, but you may want to approve it with additional conditions beyond those. I'm just as a baseline can we get that motion in for
Do they need to be restated or are they understood? I'd rather not have to restate the I'll make a mo I'll make a motion to approve those conditions.
Uh I'd second that.
Are there any are there any other conditions?
Well first let's get a motion on that. So we can get that those added. And then if you guys want to do anything else then we can because I have a feeling if we add anything else there may be discussion about them. So let's
can
we get a motion on those first.
Okay, so we have a motion and we have a second further discussion. All in favor? Aye opposed, like sign.
Gavin, you're clear on what you're adding? Okay, good. Now balance is the item in any other
and he knows what he's taking out too.
He knows what he's taking out and adding so we're good so far.
I mean I I think it's clear to me that there's not much they can do about the water. That's not a issue that they can deal with. Um
That's an engineering issue. That's n that's not something you can eyeball. That has to do with the engineers have to deal with that. I can't deal with it. And they're gonna have to prove under the law that the water is not their water is not flowing onto your property. They can't create more water on your property than you already have. And they're not responsible for the water you have now because they're not there. So
Well and also to add to that, I mean they they will the the agencies will also look at to make sure that they don't do anything to impede that outflow outflow that comes out of King Lake that goes through their property. And I I think they've already committed that that they'll do I mean they'll do everything in their power to try to help the situation. They they're not gonna fix the situation. but they're gonna help the situation.
I've got pictures of my problem.
So um all that all this stuff being said, I I mean again I go I go back to the last hearing. I mean it it's you know the On my side there's still obviously confusion and some a little bit of confusion, although it was cla and thanks for clarifying Steve, Clark, Joe about about the access. Um there's a lot of road work and a lot of attention that needs to be done to the roads, but I feel like they've they've looked at the road network. Um they've addressed the road network. I I still think there's things that the county needs to look at as far as the connection of of Ken
Road. Making that missing connection between Overpass and Petin and Elam. Um but all that being said, I mean that this is what the county want. This is this is connected city. This is what everybody's pushing them to do. I mean they y you heard Clark, you brought up that you know the the people at the county asked them to increase the the density. on the property, um to change the uses. So all that being said, I make a motion to approve A second to Jamie.
And that's with
the conditions that were added.
I'll say that yeah, there's a huge opportunity I think for to upsize that culvert that we're talking about too during the construction of this. So that's something that should seriously be considered between Swift Mud and the the county as this is going 'cause that would substantially alleviate I think the flooding condition on King Lake though. I'm not a drainage engineer, I need to to
that takes care of the upstream, but you can't flood people downstream
either.
Well looking at the wetland system that's downstream of this, it looks like it can certainly take that additional flow that's that's in there just looking at it on an aerial in front of me here. So I think there's a huge opportunity for that. But that's a county and a Swift Munt issue to deal with. Other than that, I'm I'm in support of the project.
So Brad, the the issue on Tyndall Road, this the substandard condition on Tyndall all those things that Clark mentioned that they'd have to do in terms of dust control, restoring it to its prior condition, is that something that you typically impose at Site plan approval when if they in fact use that road for construction traffic. So we don't need to address it here. Okay. I just wanted to make sure. He's nodding to said yes. Okay, thank you.
Yeah, I think Mr. Moody could probably attest to it better or state better than I could, but when it comes to managing waters watersheds, you have to when a project comes in, you have to either not affect it negatively or improve it. You can't uh you can't go the other direction. So you either have to have no effect on on your neighbors or you have to improve the situation of the neighbors. So the flooding issue. that that you're experiencing is is not really related to the project that's on the docket today, unfortunately.
And it's not, I'm not saying it doesn't need addressed. But you know, this we have to look at look at it through the eyes of this particular project that we have before us and approve based on that. And there's there's gonna have to be a a lot of studies and a lot of engineering done as is project project comes to fruition to address those those issues.
Okay.
Um what I would tell you with regard to the drainage, if you want to get to the m solve the mystery is go look at the allowable coverages that this board and that ultimately the county commission has allowed and then go see if that's what got permitted through the water management district.
And I'm gonna tell ya.
Clark, I've seen some of 'em come in with a hundred percent coverage. I'm gonna be looking through Swift Mud files and I better see C N numbers at ninety nine and a hundred when mister Simonau Submits his drainage calculations 'cause I'm betting that's what's happening here.
But that's enough for this board to solve. That's a that's an agency, that's a permitting problem. We get to the construction phase of this.
Yeah, the only uh I mean not the only problem but uh one of the problems that I still have is that I I still think maybe under the rules of the county we can't do it, but I think we should restrict construction traffic off of Tyndall Road. That's what I think.
So well it'd be clear, you technically could. Clark's not necessarily agreeing to it, but he but there have been other MPDs where Staff, the board have limited construction traffic to particular loc they were prohibited construction traffic off of certain roadways.
I know how onerous that can be to have trucks and trucks and trucks go by.
I'd I'd support that.
where you where you're living and and it's just not I don't think it's Yeah. So the question was saying we know we w we've got to look out for a bit. They have
to use Kinton. If you limited if you prohibited it off of Tyndall they would have to use Kinton for construction truck.
Which will create a problem for those people.
So it's it's Mr. Chairman M I think the the problem is there are different completely different segments of Tyndall Road. There's one where some of the neighbors live. It it takes an L Um and I'm not sure which segments of Tyndall Road you'd even be talking about. And I don't wanna prohibit construction traffic in two scenarios that I I could see happening. One is, what if it's already paved? Okay. The second thing is what if the other segment
of uh Kenton is under construction and I can't get there, you would be forcing me to then use Kenton where these folks are. And I don't want to do that. So I just I I I appreciate what you're saying, Mr. Chairman. You know, I think the role that you're
appending. Well I d even even the paved section, I don't want the trucks to destroy the already paved road either. I just you know there's I think
I mean, are they going to be working in the entire right-of-way?
I mean, I'm not an engineer. I just I I I don't know. I I would hope that we could do it at the same time, but to his point, I don't want to be driving on areas they're paving that are freshly paved. I mean, I think we can work this out and we will follow. the code on the requirements and we won't beat the road up. uh in a way that's not permissible. But I'm I'm not sure we know enough about where the construction access access may come from the n north to say that we can't use it at all.
Yeah. I mean they're different segments.
I mean I feel like there's the protections for the construction access is that are gonna be imposed on them with the development with approval of development plans.
We have to rebuild
it. There's certain things they're gonna have to do. I mean fugitive dust, uh rebuilding the road. Um
And if they don't use Tyndall they're gonna be forced to use Canton for everything. So, you know, at least that way you have the potential of splitting it out between Tyndall and Kenton construction traffic, which I'll
Okay, well no,
Okay, so uh have a motion, second, we've had discussion. Yeah. And uh we've had discussion. Is there any other discussion? If not, uh all in favor of the motion signify by saying aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed like signed? Aye. Okay. Motion carries.
Mr. Chair, if we can have the clerk uh read the some of the proofs of publications that have not been read into the record, please.
I'm just gonna state restate it. Um the items were advertised in the Tampa Bay Times on August second, two thousand twenty-three, September sixth, two thousand twenty-three, September twentieth, two thousand twenty-three, and September twenty-seventh, two thousand twenty-three, or by affidavit by certified mailings and site postings.