Zoning Amendment (Consent) - Sakelson Hudson MPUD Master Planned Unit Development - DRB Group - A Rezoning Request from an A-R Agricultural- Residential District to an MPUD Master Planned Unit Development to Allow for the Maximum Development of 63 Single-Family Detached Homes and Associated Infrastructure on Approximately 34.24 Acres

2:03:34Mm. That can be confusing when you call a neighborhood of preserve. I I will entertain a motion. Approval. Second. All in favor? Aye. Aye. Opposed, okay, P thirty nine.

2:03:53D thirty nine, we have proof of publication in the January eighth edition of the Tampa Bay Times, supplemented by affidavits of certified mailing and site postings.

2:04:04Good afternoon, William Vermillion, Planning, Development, Economic Growth, Item P thirty nine, PDE seventy-five, seventy-eight, thirty-one, or twenty-five. Uh before I proceed I'd like to enter an ex parte into the record for the clerk's office.

2:04:21Do we need a motion for that? No. For exportation.

2:04:24Yeah.

2:04:26Anything for that? Just

2:04:28we've got a bunch.

2:04:29Okay, three times like this. Oh,

2:04:32I

2:04:32would do that. Thirty nine.

2:04:41Still have our M S D.

2:04:44No, you're all good. Appreciate it.

2:04:48This is a rezoning request from AR, Agricultural Residential to Master Planned Unit Development and PUD to allow for the maximum development of 63 single-family detached homes and associated infrastructure on 34.24 acres. Just south of Hudson Avenue.

2:05:05Here's the location map south of Hudson Avenue.

2:05:12Like I mentioned before, this is for 63 single family detached with the minimum lot size of 60 feet by 120. And associated infrastructure on that 34 acres in the northwest of Pasco County in the north market area.

2:05:29Here is the location map. Just south of Hudson Avenue, extends down to Fox Fire Drive. The existing zoning showing AR agricultural residential.

2:05:43And the future land use map.

2:05:47Go on press three. Here's a context map. Of the location of this M P Um just to the east we have the Palm Wind MPUD that was approved about a year, year and a half ago for three hundred and nineteen single family homes that extends all the way down to uh Sheik's Road from the north or from the south all the way up to Hudson Avenue. And this shows Firefox Drive and the current end of Colony Road.

2:06:17This M PUD with this master plan will be constructing a two-lane segment of the future colony road to their project access and then dedicating the rest down to the southern boundary as well as dedicating right of way for a connection from the Palm Wind imputee that can be sh that can be seen on the arrow there on the bottom or the right-of-way for Colony Road extends south.

2:06:45A couple things with the the binding conceptual plan on this one. Staff worked with the applicant to ensure proper pedestrian circulation throughout this project. It is faint to see, but the applicant did provide A pedestrian interconnect. to the northwest as well as to the west in lieu of vehicular connections as they're seeking a variation from nine oh one sixty eleven street design and dedication requirements. those pedestrian interconnects flow through the entirety of the project as

2:07:16it's currently laid out. To ensure uh proper pedestrian circulation for if and when those pieces of land are ultimately developed. Can can

2:07:24you point to those?

2:07:25Yeah, I can't see him on the map.

2:07:28Um

2:07:30Sorry, the uh My pointer's not working. Um, do you mind will you drag the mouse over there for him? Yeah.

2:07:43Double click it. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, let me go back. Sorry about that.

2:07:53Mm-hmm.

2:07:54No. Apologies.

2:08:03All right. You be my driver. So Along that western edge where you there's the uh the curve in the road So the sidewalk comes in along the street and then there's actually a gap there in between Two homes. No no. So follow that south. And now through up.

2:08:24No no.

2:08:25Why don't you take the mouse? Can I

2:08:27can I use the

2:08:27mouth?

2:08:32Yeah, it's gonna drive on the top.

2:08:35I was gonna bad

2:08:44Mr. Siverson, will you please point out those pedestrian connections?

2:08:59Okay, perfect. So cur now treat trace your arrow up along that road. Up colony, and then right there, stop, go down. The sidewalk will extend there off the road to a pedestrian connection to That parcel if it's developed, which will then be at the corner of Colony and Hudson. So it will be a prime redevelopment portion at the uh the corner of those two roads, but it will also extend north up Colony Road. And now, Mr. Siverson, please show us the

2:09:29Is that wider than five feet? Is that a multi-use or a five foot sidewalk, which is one person and a dog? Not two people walking side by side.

2:09:39So let me just

2:09:43Mm do you mind ma Madam Chairman Mariano. So you're telling me the sidewalk goes up to kind of where the black line stops and comes back down, it doesn't go all the way up to Hudson Avenue.

2:09:52No, it it does both. It diverges in in sort of a a forking method, one going to provide the connection to that property. But also continuing north up to Hudson Avenue. So the direct connection all the way to Hudson Avenue. Yes sir. Okay. And then it also goes in between uh There's that corner lot there. Thank you, Kurt. Um the sidewalk will also Come off of that road in another forking manner to provide an interconnect to that property. just to the west and then

2:10:22also continue along the the regular residential pattern. For if you're not going to be able to Um that property is developed. The reason a vehicular interconnect wasn't provided there, there's a significant elevation grade change that didn't permit um vehicular access, it wouldn't have been safe, but a pedestrian access would be feasible.

2:10:46These are the exhibits for the colony road improvement that that hatched lining showing. the portion of the road that's gonna be constructed by the applicant for their project access. It's gonna be the the two lanes of the ultimate 124 foot segment that was approved by the the PD and E by the Board of County Commissioners some years ago, as well as the rest of the dedication of the 124 feet down to the southern property line. that pond of its highlighted up at the corner of Hudson. Yes. That

2:11:16pond is roughly.

2:11:20As it's gonna be holding uh water from Hudson Avenue and this uh this Vision Road. the the rest of the pond sites aren't credible.

2:11:30Like I mentioned before, the variation from nine and one sixty eleven street design and dedication requirements In lieu of those vehicular connections Um to the west, we provided enhanced pedestrian mobility in lieu of that connection. as well as a variation from nine oh one two I, which I just spoke to Uh originally this was Uh expected to be 160 feet of right-of-way for Colony Road. After P D and E study was approved by the Board of County Commissioners, it was determined it needed to be reduced. To

2:12:00124 feet, and this is consistent with that BCC route study for 124 feet of an urban cross section.

2:12:08Can I may I ask that question? What is enhanced pedestrian? versus regular pedestrian.

2:12:15Enhanced as in They originally weren't going to provide the pedestrian connections to the west because of their pattern of the residential layout as well as to the northwest. when staff uh was in the negotiation process of the M Pud Initially we wanted full vehicular connections to the west. per the code nine one sixty eleven. Uh weighing the elevation different constraints. Staff decided that if a pedestrian connection was provided there, that

2:12:45we were amenable to their variation from the code from a full vehicular access.

2:12:49Yeah.

2:12:54I gotta look it up. Okay.

2:13:00Okay.

2:13:02Thank you.

2:13:03Applicant.

2:13:16Do you all have my PowerPoint presentation?

2:13:20Sorry.

2:13:28Any motion for that one?

2:13:32Yes, a if you would receive

2:13:34and file this PowerPoint.

2:13:37All in favor?

2:13:38Aye.

2:13:38Aye.

2:14:04Don't have the number anymore. What number was it?

2:14:20Thank you.

2:14:25Staff did a very good job going through the details, so let me kind of just highlight a few things. I mean you can see our project here on Hudson Avenue. We always know where the schools are is important. So we've measured we've measured how far they are. They're more than two miles. Um our kids will be bused to those schools. This is the site plan which um William showed you. Showing we did a lot quite a bit of work. This one took work as well because we have a a Vision Road coming through. So we worked

2:14:55with um the County Engineer and the County Attorney's Office on ultimately how we're gonna design um Colony Road. There was a difference between your right-of-way tables and your adopted PDE. So we are using the section from the PDE, which is a little different from your tables, but the PDE is more specific than your tables. We will be doing Colony Road, our portion from Hudson Avenue to our entrance and then donating the rest of the right-of-way. We will also there's also a little sliver which

2:15:25David Goldstein caught at um at Planning Commission to make sure that Palm Winds, which is to our east, w can connect to future colony roads. So we actually have a little bit of extra right of way that we're gonna to um You convey as well so that palm woods can have connectivity to to uh colony road. Ultimately the land use in this is for this property is res three, this whole area is res three. Which allows a maximum of 102 units. We are

2:15:55proposing 63. Current zoning is 34. We are also proposing 60 by 120 foot lots. Those are 7,200 square foot lots. Your R4 district, which is your most dense district of a the Euclidean district, are 6,000 square foot lots. Ultimately, again, talking about this area in context of developing the development and the growth in this area. You put a vision road in, which means you're com you're looking to have growth. You have a res 3 land use in

2:16:25all of this area and central water and sewer. In context. In June of 2023, this board approved the Palmwinds MPUD, which you can see our project, how it complements. The Palmlands MPUD has 40 and 50 foot lots, 313 of them. Their gross acreage is two point six seven dwelling units per acre. To complement that, we are proposing sixty by one hundred and

2:16:55twenty foot lots here at one point eight dwelling units per acre. So we thought it'd be important to see how the two projects fit. We will be providing a housing type that that's not um being provided over at Palmlands. This is D R B. Uh the client is D R B and they these are their elevations of some of their products. We included this because I think you'll find these products to be, you know What they call these are things step up, the sixty foot lots, the seventy two

2:17:26hundred square foot lots, and and this is the step up renderings.

2:17:32And with that, I know there's some public comment ultimately I n I would tell you that One of the things that probably will come up, which maybe we'll just talk about now, is that We have provided the interconnectivity that's required by the code. From our project to Foxfire Drive. Foxfire Drive is a standard county maintained road meeting your minimum standard requirements. Got asked a lot about this at at Planning Commission and I ultimately my answer is that Your

2:18:03code says it. I get asked about it all the time, obviously. We just talked about connectivity for a while there. And that the reason why we have connectivity to Foxfire is that your code requires it. So it's 901.6.11. It allows for Additional traffic circulation, additional way way for traffic that's coming from the south. They don't have to go down Foxfire and then go over to Peachtree Road. They ultimately will be able to come through our project. providing different ways to get to Hudson Avenue, which is what your code's

2:18:33encouraging, and that's why we have c the connectivity to um Box Fair Drive.

2:18:41I ask I have a couple questions. Does anyone else? Um who is this the road section designed by Margaret? Who who designed this road section? I'm just curious.

2:18:51A was ultimately a consultant for the P D and E.

2:18:55I'm just trying to understand a five foot sidewalk and two eight foot bike lanes. And we had this debate at the T M A. I uh I I like to cycle, but I don't cycle with traffic. Yeah, I know some Dedicated cyclists prefer the road to the sidewalk, but if But I sure wouldn't let any of my kids ride in the road. So why are we devoting so much to the road and not enough to a multi use path? Even three feet more on the multi use

2:19:25path. Uh

2:19:33That's you, Mr. County Engineer.

2:19:36Uh Madam Chair, the typical section Actually that was as shown in the uh Route study that was approved by the board in two thousand two differs slightly from what's on the screen, but I agree with you.

2:19:49Can we adjust this? I mean this isn't her, right? She's not building are you building this road?

2:19:56We're building a portion of it.

2:19:57Well then I definitely want to discuss this because I d this is not the road we should be building. If this was we designed this in two thousand two, it's n it's not right in Um I don't even understand some of this, so Can we I don't hold up your project. Um but we certainly can do better on the road. Right.

2:20:19We have our engineer come up and talk engineering.

2:20:22Madam Chairman

2:20:24M Great pickup. Because I think if you were able to build that road a little narrower you get more of that road coming down to prob possibly make that connection. Sooner than later.

2:20:39Well,

2:20:41Maybe, but certainly that isn't the roadscape that we should be building.

2:20:47Trent Stevenson level up consulting, 505 East Jackson, uh Tampa, Florida. I have been sworn. Um this is the half section, so we're only building the western side. So um It's

2:20:57four lanes divided?

2:20:59Yes, yes ma'am.

2:21:00Oh wow.

2:21:00So we're only building the west side.

2:21:02It's kind of big.

2:21:03On the east side, there will be a multi-use path when you guys come in and build the the ultimate section. There will be another uh multi-use path.

2:21:11Okay, so this is a big road like little or Okay, I had no idea.

2:21:17So what what we do what we agreed with uh Nick when we went through our negotiations is the um because we are it only is only going to be a two-lane road until the ultimate build out, we are Adding an extra bike lane. So both directions will have bike lanes. That bike lane on the east side will be demoed when you come in and build the ultimate additional two lanes.

2:21:38But I still wonder if we need this wide of a road section. And this is the debate we were having in V O P eight, right? This is a really ri wide road.

2:21:48Eight foot bite lanes or four. Madam Chair, if I could. Yeah. I so I think there's actually a a mistake in the graphic. The the typical section that was approved in 2002 had five foot sidewalks, four foot bike lanes. and twelve foot travel lanes. I think what they're now showing is four uh they I think they've mislabeled the bike lanes as eight feet instead of four. And they're showing a reduction from the travel lanes that were approved in the route study in 2002 from twelve to eleven. Honestly,

2:22:18I I would love to have a a more protracted discussion with the board about what the typical sections should be that we are typically that we're going to construct on our Vision Road Network. There's a twenty nineteen resolution that the board adopted at that time directing my predecessor to build roads with on-street bike lanes every time we touched a road. And and then a twelve foot path on one side and a five foot path on the other side. If the board wants to revisit that, we can certainly bring alternatives back for

2:22:48consideration. They do have implications with respect to comprehensive planning because we establish a footprint for our vision road network based on the components of the road that we expect to construct.

2:23:00What is the two the what is the six foot offset? What is that? That's

2:23:05just green

2:23:06space. And then we have a nine foot of green space. So we have fifteen feet. Not that I I love my tree, you know, if this is gonna have Oak trees going downside is gonna be a beautiful road, but do we need both of those green spaces?

2:23:18So real quick to clarify, the the bike lanes are actually per year detail uh five feet.

2:23:24Oh well it says eight foot here.

2:23:28I don't know which one that is on the slide. The and again the uh your stable the uh Yeah, the greens that that's the detail from your ultimate build out as far as the

2:23:40Well how can we move this forward but fix you know work on that? What's what would you be your recommendation from staff?

2:23:50I guess we just have to work them on the crossing.

2:23:51If the board doesn't want this facility to be constructed with on street bike lanes, then we can narrow the roadway surface to just include the two foot curb and gutter on the left, two eleven foot travel lanes, stabilize shoulder on the right, and put the additional uh impervious area into the pathway on the west side. Make that either a ten or a twelve foot pathway on the west side.

2:24:15But this is a main you know, and if that can, you know, meander a little through that green space, that's better. That'd be beautiful.

2:24:25So our team is fine with is with The cross section that you guys are talking about ultimately it's your it's your road.

2:24:32Yeah.

2:24:33It's your cross section. So as long as we're not proposing anything that's gonna cost them more, which I don't think it will. No, I think we're talking about it. I think I think we're fine. We're fine with ultimately if you approve this, that we have a condition that or part of your motion that says But you're approving the cross section as as approved by the county engineer and then we'll just fix the paperwork before it's executed. So we're we're flexible because it is your road um and we respect that.

2:25:00I I think that we should approve it with the conditions that we we don't have to figure out what our roads look like right right here right now. I don't think we should. But let's approve it with the conditions that we work on with our engineering and our state.

2:25:16We'll come up with something for condition.

2:25:21Okay. This is a public hearing. Does anyone want to speak to this item?

2:25:24We we have numerous signed up. Uh Mr. Wynn.

2:25:27Okay.

2:25:35Good afternoon, elected officials. Clinton Wynn [address removed]. Um from this map it looks like invisible vision roads, not vision roads. Um I've got some bullet points here, but I'm not sure. Our roads, Ms. Starkey, are really important. So having a plan now before we do this is important. I'm gonna try and get through my notes. I'm not sure what um Ms. Will Hight was saying. that she's not her sure how Sackleson is gonna compliment

2:26:05palm wind. You guys crammed palm wind through to fair winds. Um There are three different hearings. On the third and final hearing, you guys did not allow public comment. You went back, you day di delayed this ninety days. He'd opened up in the fair winds. Where we have no sidewalks. We have mothers and fathers walking their kids in the mud to the school bus. We have no infrastructure. We have fatalities at colony in fifty-two. We have fair winds now connected

2:26:35through the colony. Bumper to bumper, no light. No street signs, nothing. You guys do a field trip and come to our neighborhood and see how it is. Um so I have a question about that. Um As you can tell I'm pretty heated. When Palm Wind was originally approved, it was approved for 305 homes, but now it was 319. Where did that change and who did that? There's twenty-two homes right now there. What I want to know is how the Shoman

2:27:06property is being rezoned aggressive. into this development. This is a place called Shady Oaks Ranches, and it's comprised of thirty properties that are agricultural. These families invested They have animals and this is gonna affect code enforcement big time. So now do we have to now not be able to shoot? Not be able to clean. work out there on our property, have a bonfire. I was silenced by the county and to do a burn on my ag land Because of

2:27:36the new development. So if there's ever a bonfire from some of the neighbors and it spreads through my pine tree forest, am I now liable? That's it that's unacceptable. I'm doing all my property to preserve my agricultural heritage here. Um I'm requesting a 90-day table this. Because I think you owe it to the residents.

2:27:59Fox fire And Colony Road. Colony Road is a major issue, guys. We all know it. And then th this is an invisible road. Colony Road needs to be handled by the builders, not by the taxpayer or anything else. So all this development that you're bringing in there were not properly planted. And I'm gonna keep complaining on all my committees. Infrastructure, infrastructure, infrastructure. I also go to all your meetings The twenty fifty plan. I think that's just a pile of you know what. Because

2:28:30I go, I draw little trees on all the pastures, I draw little animals, all the things you guys tell us to do as citizens, we put our time in. And it's ignored. So I know I come up here hostile. I'm not against development, so understand that. I want proper infrastructure. Thank you.

2:28:49Ms. Kosmeric.

2:28:54Mar

2:28:54Marcia

2:28:55Kasmeric.

2:28:56Marcia Kasmeric. I live on [address removed]. And I am the property. You were sworn? Yes, sir.

2:29:05Okay. That's all you just need to say that.

2:29:07I live at Directly across from where they're Entrance? On Foxfire, and it is Foxfire for the record, not Firefox. Um

2:29:22I raise sheep. Milk sheep. We also raise dairy goats. And them being um a housing development right across the street. Especially two story homes. They're gonna be seeing On the property? All kinds of things. And yes, we do have bonfires. I open up for four H clubs.

2:29:53This is really gonna affect our lifestyles. I I didn't buy into a neighborhood, into a subdivision per se. But it's being brought to my doorste literally to my doorstep. Our properties Are parallel. Probably exactly across the street.

2:30:19I've got kids that go to the bus stop. My son almost got hit two weeks ago. Because Of the traffic already. Because you opened up um what is that neighborhood called? Not Shadow Ridge? Meadow Oaks onto Fairwinds.

2:30:41Now they come over and they they're gonna go to Hudson Avenue, so obviously they come up Colony Road. Foxfire, Depeach. The traffic, it's already there. Just from opening up. And I don't even oh, I think that was opened up maybe three years ago. And then I heard about the poem. I know I'm not sure if I have that. proper neighborhood that y'all have been talking about Home Windsor something. That comes all the way from Hudson Avenue

2:31:12to Fair winds. Hmm. So obviously there's more and more traffic and now you're gonna have an entrance From a subdivision. Right directly on Fox Fire Drive.

2:31:32So there's two main topics is the traffic. M my children aren't safe for walking. God forbid if one of my goats or sheep get out there. Or dogs? Uh how many people are gonna stick their hands over I've got horses. I can't even go horseback riding anymore. I bought out there. 'Cause we did go horseback riding. There used to be places to go and now there's nowhere. I don't dare to go out there with the horses. 'Cause you have all these cars and do they go around

2:32:02you? No, they only go around the school buses. But school buses are going too slow. And the road's not wide enough legally to pass, in my opinion. So that makes for dangerous.

2:32:18And I've been there twenty five years. When I first moved there, we did go riding down the road. And it it was nice now.

2:32:27Thank you very much. Your I'm sorry, I didn't see your your uh buzzer go off. Next.

2:32:33Uh next up would be Joelle Neri.

2:32:43Joelle Neary, [address removed]. And yes, I was sworn in. I'm here representing the Angeles. We are just north of this property build. Actually just north of Palmwoods. But Palmwoods and this are both affecting the traffic patterns in our area. Um I am concerned about the infrastructure and not being able to support the traffic that this will add. We have a bus stop literally outside our property. There

2:33:13is one little boy that gets picked up on that blind corner on the S turn. And I am concerned every day for him. Um I don't think that we have the infrastructure to support even more without a full study of some kind because this is getting crazy. Traffic is getting busy, it's getting insane, it is dangerous for students walking. for everything and yes, we bought in a rural area. We have seventeen acres. We're rural, our neighbors were rural, and now it's not

2:33:43being that way anymore. And I know people are building, and I know people are coming into the community, and that's great for support. But I am concerned over the infrastructure for the whole area just because of these traffic patterns. There's no lights, there's no Sidewalk on Hudson Avenue. And that's just the north side. And I know you're talking about further south, but it's gonna be coming north. And that is our concern. Um, not only for the community, but my residents, because my residents

2:34:13are all in wheelchairs and that is an issue. So thank you. Thank you.

2:34:19Thanks for the great work your family does too.

2:34:22Ravis Johns.

2:34:27Good afternoon, board. Thank you very much for uh for hearing this. Uh Rivas Johns [address removed]. Um I'd like to start off by saying, you know, I had a lot to say, a lot of notes, but um after sitting here You were sworn?

2:34:43I'm sorry.

2:34:45Yes, I was.

2:34:45You've been here all day.

2:34:47Pretty much. And uh after uh hearing what uh What's uh been going on in this meeting for the last few days, it's actually con I mean excuse me, the last few hours. It's it's it's been concerning to see how many uh Um places that Miss Will Hyde is actually um over or looking over into for the county and uh Well I guess I'd like to get to the right-of-way. Um In the twenty fifty year plan, Colony Road was set Slated. to run all the way through to

2:35:17Hudson. Now with that being said I've been living in that spot that I built my house. on three acres for Fifteen years. And when I bought it until right now You must have one acre or more to build. And Shady Oak Ranches. With them buying that piece of parcel. that connects into Shady Oaks Ranches. is a violation as far as I'm

2:35:47concerned because now you're taking away the credibility of our one acre and up plots. which is losing value to our houses and our property. Now, with that being said, in a twenty, fifty year plan, I was gonna build another house on the other side of my property. But permitting wouldn't allow me to pull permits for the simple fact that I was in the twenty fifty year land uh plan for colony road. Now with that being said, I see all these buildings going around me that the permitting and the

2:36:17board is allowing to build. But yet They won't let me build anything on my property because that roadway is in a twenty-fifty year plan. Now, if you actually look where the road comes out, the only thing that they're going to do is from out their subdivision and up to Hudson Avenue. There's another way. They didn't have to try to have this piece of property built, they could have ran straight across and ran as a second outlet to the road that they're showing there

2:36:48that's not even a road, it's just a connection. That is about Mm, I'd say a little more than five hundred yards. That they can tie into Colony Road and make that an easier pathway straight to Hudson Avenue, like is in the twenty fifty year plan, instead of running everybody through our neighborhood. We already have a hard time getting in and out. The traffic is ridiculous and the subdivisions are not even done yet. You're talking thirteen thirteen hundred houses and possibly more because there's more subdivisions around us that have already

2:37:18been proved approved and it's it's just absolutely ridiculous and the traffic's getting worse and worse. Every time a car or a big truck goes by my house Everything in the house shakes. You know, and and you know, you guys have a plan, a vision, twenty fifty, but you don't stick to it. You inconvenience everybody else. Thank you very much for your time. I do appreciate it.

2:37:41Thank you. So you're on the corner of Fox Fire and Colony. Yes. Yeah. Okay, I just looked at

2:37:48I'm my property lines up with the entrance where it comes out of that property.

2:37:53Okay, thank you. Bridget Erickson is the next one signed up.

2:38:00Hi, my name is Bridget Erickson. I live at [address removed]. I have been sworn in. Um I have horses, so I'm concerned about changing it from AG to M P-U-D. Secondly, I would may I approach this map right here?

2:38:16She's she's

2:38:17see this little gray spot right there where colony goes like that. That's my house. But I live there.

2:38:23You you need to um stay at the mic or your

2:38:26that protective plan goes right through my living room. I've lived there for eighteen years. I'm a Florida resident. I've been in Pasco County over thirty-five years. I've invested my time, my blood, my sweat and tears in that property with my horses. I've built my stalls, I've built my pole barn, I live There. My family's lived here. My son goes to high went to high school here. I have grandchildren here. And now you're talking about these pretty little sidewalks and about the bicyclists for new people. What about the people that have lived in Pasco County that have been paying

2:38:56taxes for all the time that we've lived here? What about the people that have contributed to Pasco County? You're pushing us out to bring new people in, and it's not fair to all of us. We where's the give where's this give and take here? You're taking, taking, taking from Pasco County residents, but you're not giving us anything back. And again, main point, that's my home. You gotta go right through my living room. That's not gonna happen. You cannot take my livelihood. You can't take my life away. You can't take my home away. This needs

2:39:26to be reconstructed, redone, and uh It needs to be re-looked at so they can plan another way to put they can go colony road straight up. Why do they have to go to the corner like that? Why do you have to go through my land? Why do you have to go through my living room? Why can't you just go straight up? I mean I don't care about your sidewalks. I don't care about your little ponds. I don't care about how big a sidewalk is. I care about that's where I live and sleep and reside. Thank you.

2:39:53Thank you. Thanks. That's all we have signed up in advance.

2:39:56Come on up. Is there anyone else who wishes to speak to this item? If so, please get in line.

2:40:05Yeah, I speak.

2:40:06Yes.

2:40:06Hello, my name is Jeremy Ruffey. I'm with [address removed] and I have been sworn in

2:40:12What what city is that? White

2:40:13White

2:40:14Walnut?

2:40:15Yes, White Walnut Street. Four, six,

2:40:17okay.

2:40:19Mr. Mariano, you and I spoke when you came to my station on uh this month uh of the thirteenth, and you said, you know Well unfortunately I wasn't able to get those people together, but I do have approximately thirty people here who feel the same way. But they're hard working people like me and they just can't be here 'cause they're they're doing their jobs. I moved here for the greenery. I'm okay with building, but when you start pushing out animals and you create safety issues, just like last uh I think it was November of last year, headed to work and all of a sudden what do I see? I see a child who's struck

2:40:49at a bus stop. And why? Well he was fatally uh injured because people are are going around trying to avoid these traffic lights. They're going through our subdivisions and they're speeding, they're not paying attention and struck 'em and killed them. The pedestrian traffic, I run these calls every day. Nobody else runs these calls. I see these calls. Pedestrians are hit more often than you would know. Um, but when we start pushing out wildlife, you know, we have the sandhill cranes is if you see two sandhill cranes together, they're like a married couple. They will mate for life. So then when you see one

2:41:19just walking around all lonely, it's because it will no longer mate for life. Because they're being wiped out. The gopher tortoises. They create homes for 350 other species of animals. And what do we do? We put concrete on top of them. And it takes them about a year to die. So they pretty much starve to death. We got migrating birds. We have deer, raccoons, all being killed. There's uh even talk about a black wolf. Look up a black wolf. Apparently it was extinct for about 100 years, but now we're saying we're seeing them in our areas because they got nowhere else to go. Uh Knox

2:41:50gas. All these extra vehicles are creating extra pollution that we're sitting in in traffic. You know, I was just in Belgium and people there cough non-stop because of all the NOx gases coming out of our vehicles. What are Knox gases? Nitric oxide and nitrogen dioxide. Are these the things that are causing cancer as we sit in 'em and US 19 as we can go longer get anywhere? Uh smog and astray come from those two things. Infrastructure. US nineteen. I can't do it anymore. Getting my kids every day from Tarpon Springs, which I'm already late getting them, because I'm here to

2:42:20speak for everybody who cannot be here. Fifty-two is still two lanes, yet we're worried about all this other stuff. You know, w what about our water, our power? You know, nobody's thinking about our you know, people like me, right now, uh, you know, I got a septic tank that won't drain because all this increased building is pushing it more towards me. You're you guys are elevating your lands, you have the money to do that, I don't. Um what happens, you know, in a state of emergency when we need to get out of here. How the hell are everybody going to evacuate this area when these roads are deadlocked? And

2:42:51what happens with people like me is everyone already mentioned, you know, we want to go shoot, we wanna have our cows, our horses, have our kids have what I had. you know, years of having land, our kids are on phones all day. Instead of being out in nature, that's what they want to do and everyone's pushing towards that. That's not what I want. I don't want to see, you know these houses packed together and then creates all these issues. Like just like last time I tried to get food uh with all these extra people here, the food just uh sells out even quicker. Uh I don't know when we're gonna stop bulldozing. We need to start preserving

2:43:21our our resources. That's just me.

2:43:24Thank you. Okay, this is our last speaker today. Is there anyone online?

2:43:29And not for this item.

2:43:31Hi,

2:43:32Pastor Jen uh Kerouac [address removed]. And some of these folks have come to the Shady Hills Civic Association meetings, so I felt it important to just advocate uh you know, for their position. Um and just in that I know that most everyone knows of the golden rule, do unto those that as you would have done to yourself. And it sounds as if maybe one of the neighbors is not being as great of

2:44:02a neighbor. Um those with more land are not more important than those that don't have as much land. the neighbors should be equally and you know, I just most of these projects, the reason why people come and just are concerned and those that are concerned and can't attend because they're working Is because you know they don't know necessarily the intricacies. They maybe there are things that could be

2:44:32worked out, and then we spend time here, you know, trying to advocate for a position that maybe otherwise would have been worked out. I understand not every situation requires a neighborhood meeting, but Like, come on, let's be a good neighbor. As the gentleman said, Ms. Will Hight uh advocates for many landowners, you know, and and there are like a few that likewise, as Ms. Will Hight. I mean, have a neighborhood meeting, meet with the folks around you, let

2:45:02them know, see if there's something that you know could be advocated. And I ask that you as As as the leaders in this county, that you would ask the same, that that they begin to try and advocate. and collaborate in a positive way so that you know we can be still remain a good community in Florida.

2:45:30Okay. Um to the applicant.

2:45:35And I have a question on the vision road I guess. Yeah,

2:45:38me too. I have a comment.

2:45:41Barbara Wilhite for the applicant.

2:45:45I understand the speaker's and the person that owns the home on Division Road is Those are decisions, hard decisions you have to make when you set out where you want vision roads and then you do a P D D and E and the P D and E's that you do weigh out where to get the right of way. Make sure make sure everyone

2:45:59knows what a P D and E is, 'cause there's people who don't know who

2:46:03I know it is P D and E, but what's the proper name?

2:46:06Uh it's an F dot term. It's project Development and Environmental Study. And what we do in uh the case is

2:46:13a route study is choosing the alignment of a road, excuse me, and the drainage facility locations so that we can actually construct the network needed to move people around.

2:46:22Okay, thank you.

2:46:26So ultimately there's a process you guys go through and ultimately there's public hearing on that vision road and so we we are been asked to accommodate your road and so that's what we're doing. That's why colony road is on our property. Would my client probably like to develop the whole thing and push the road on somebody else's property? Sure. I mean that might be the thing. But no we we were accommodating the road. We were asked to accommodate the road. Your P and E P D and E asked us to accommodate the road. So that's how the road came to be. We didn't choose the alignment We didn't even choose the cross section. We obviously are

2:46:57going to work on a better cross section. I think one of the things you have to have perspective is that this property since 1989 has all been um approved by the county as residential three. It's a suburban density, three units per acre. Um say that again. Three units per acre is your land use designation for this for this area. It's not just this property. I mean it's all s south of Hudson Avenue. It's a s it's res three. So when you talk about did we Did we look at the community you were coming to?

2:47:27We did. Res three allows a hundred and two units. Next door, you approved. Palm winds. With forty and fifty foot lots. We didn't come and propose 40 and 50 foot lots. We didn't come and propose 6,000 square foot lots, which are your R4 district. We didn't come and propose an R4 district without conditions. We came forward as an MPUD to exceed your R4 district. And we did that because The client was committed to a quality

2:47:57project and all of your standards regarding architectural standards and the things that you like to see in MPUDs that if I would have come as an R4 with 6,000 square foot lots. It would just be in your zoning district. Pastor Dan and and I guess they know me by name now. Um You know, I grew up in this community as well and care about it, but when we look at a place where we're gonna bring a project where I look at with my clients, we actually look at where we're bringing that project. And that's why we're bringing forward 633 units instead of

2:48:27102. That's why we're bringing forward sixty by one hundred and twenty foot lots, seventy two hundred square feet, instead of four thousand square feet or five thousand square feet or even your code that says six thousand square feet.

2:48:41Where you have central water and sewer where you make those investments in center water and sewer is where your growth is ultimately gonna go. Again, the connection to Boxfire is a code requirement so that you have different connectivity, people can travel different ways, that's why it's there. I would add that you know Commissioner Mariano did mention when I spoke to him, like could there be a disclosure, a written disclosure for our residents that they can appreciate that there are surrounding residents that have an agricultural

2:49:12lifestyle and I did prepare um a condition And I did run it by it's been such a long day. I did run it by uh Mr. Goldstein and staff. That we could add to a disclosure. So there is that mutual. Our residents know that there are neighbors that have an agricultural lifestyle. So I'm gonna pass this out. Um

2:49:32take a motion. Do I have a second?

2:49:35Second.

2:49:36All in favor? Aye? Aye.

2:49:46With regard to wildlife, we do wildlife surveys and gopher tortoises are no longer allowed to be just um mitigated on site. You have to move them. quite a process to do that, quite an expense to clients to do that, but they cannot put concrete on them and suffocate them. They have to be moved. And again we have to do all the wildlife surveys and we have to do them multiple times. We had to do them with the MPUD, we have to do them again at Pelomary Plan. They're only good for eighteen months. And then even after that, when we go out to actually start development, your staff

2:50:17goes out again, and if any gopher tortoises have come onto the site since we've moved them all, then they have to be taken care of as well. It's a condition that deals with any any wildlife that comes onto the site after we start construction. We can't still still aren't allowed to put concrete over them or suffocate gopher tortoises.

2:50:35I think that's all I have. Um I think everything else we have talked about. If you have any particular questions for myself, my team, level up, my clients, DRB, or Steve Henry, who has done our traffic, uh I w I would add We heard a lot about the intersection of State Road 52 and Colony at um at the Planning Commission. Hudson and fifty-two? Fifty-two. Fifty-two and colony. Yeah, all the way down. I know we're at Hudson. Oh yeah. I looked at it here

2:51:05on the map.

2:51:06The fact that that intersection doesn't have an intersection. Um but and we staff actually researched that after planning commission and I was sent a copy of it. That the F D OT is in the process of doing improvements to that intersection to make it signalized. So I think that's a response to people's concerns that F DOT is actually moving that forward. So I wanted to let you know that. If you want any more details about that, I'm not the detail person, but I can tell you that DOT is already working on it, knows

2:51:36of that issue, and they're planning on making that a signalized intersection.

2:51:40I do have one question 'cause I'm here on Google Maps looking at this property. Does the Do the is there a Sackleson family I'm gonna guess? Or

2:51:50I think that's who the yes, that's the the family that we're buying the property from.

2:51:54Okay, and do they live on this property?

2:51:58No. So I'm looking at probably I'm looking at a lot of activity and dumping on this property. There someone someone's using this property. This is kinda what happens when

2:52:14Someone's four wheel someone else's four wheel driving camping.

2:52:22And I That that could be a problem. Um

2:52:28Uh The other thing is I want to say About the bonfires. And coming from family has bonfires all the time. You you're allowed to do that. I mean we have we have residents in Trinity Trinity and um What's the name of that golf course there in Trinity?

2:52:48That one. What's the name of that golf course? There there are res there are people in Fox Hollow who have, you know, the the the um solos or whatever or or homemade bonfires in their backyard. And I know I had a resident who was complaining about it. She had asthma. But fully within that homeowner's right to have a bonfire in their yard. So don't if this goes through Don't think that you can't still enjoy your own property. You you cannot raise your hand from the audience. Um but you can still continue to own your Enjoy

2:53:19your property. So Um

2:53:23So how can we help them with the road issue if it's already Well you know that's conceptual. Right. No, I know with the I mean Also that if you're having all that development around there. Just what d what do the roads look like? Well

2:53:39we I think we have to work that out amongst ourselves. We have this issue in other places too, that we're using a model from two thousand and two. Is that what you said?

2:53:47Two thousand two board approval of a route study. Oh

2:53:50route study for colony

2:53:51road.

2:53:51Okay. Well Yeah, yeah. You know, the road needs to connect. It's an important connector from Hudson to fifty two. If we don't have these kind of interconnects then our roads will be at a standstill. So we must, must complete the grid. But we have to do it thoughtfully and respectfully and I don't think this is happening anytime soon. But It's not the responsibility of these guys to figure out our

2:54:23lady that was here if she's here, like if somebody could talk to her, you know, about You know, not going through her living room.

2:54:31And I think I you cannot you cannot talk from out there, I'm so sorry. But it won't you know w Mm. There's a long process and a lot of time before anything happens and you will be included, everyone will be included in in that discussion. There'll be public hearing and things like that. So um

2:54:51is there someone that could talk to her right now?

2:54:55After we're done? Thank you, Nick. You can talk w meet her in the back with the county engineer. Thank you. Okay, um Commissioner Oriano.

2:55:03Yeah, can you um put up the slide before with the cyclobs and there you go.

2:55:15Is that one right there? Yes. So if you look on the right side of that. That develops there much more dense, but that thing connects Down to Fairwinds, which is a lot further to the south. We get a situation where And I'm I'm not I'm not sure what's right to the side to them, et cetera, but You know, all these one acre lots, people are doing all sorts of agricultural, et cetera, and all of a sudden we're gonna squeeze it right in. And the worst part is we're not even allowing for the road Yeah. Well if you wanted

2:55:45to show a benefit, so be it. But right now you're gonna take all that extra traffic. And those you ever go up there. If you go up Colony Road, you gotta take a right on Fox Fire, you gotta come up to another turn, take another right turn. And then you're gonna thought it's an avido. Ideal. Um And I will tell you I I wish that staff had worked with us closer. Because this development coming in on Palmwind. Had this work with this one better? They could have made that connection to Colony right through their property. Could've gone right along the edge. But That

2:56:15didn't happen. And that's what we do, that's the type of thing we need to change what we're doing. If we're gonna come into a rural area like this and have development come in, it's gotta work better. Right now. Again, just with the dimensions of what that road was supposed to be. Uh and Mrs. Ericsson, I I looked at your house right there and I'm watching. How can we design a ho uh uh a roadway going right through somebody's house? Why would we do that, especially when we could have gone up a little bit further in the other development and then brought it over from there when we saw we were making a change, not this road where the roadway was going to go? So To

2:56:45me it's like th these vision roads are tough we're seeing today. But handling this one here. Um to me it it's it's it's it's not ready. Um That connection to Collie Road needs to be done. to take the roadway on Foxfire and just throw more traffic down there? I would rather even see a cul-de-sac or even just a a T section there and just let the people if they're gonna come in there that they gotta go up on Hudson Avenue and that's their only way in and out. uh unless it connects over to the other neighborhood there, but to bring 'em down Fox Fire and up and around.

2:57:16Let them go straight up and over. They don't need any more traffic right there. These are rural roads. that are are dangerous at night. I mean You know, people have signs up there, they got reflectors up there. It's not a it's not a great scenario. And to tell a neighbor That has a Acre parcel and he can't build another home on the other ACO, but now we're gonna let R 4 come in. What are we doing? I mean gr I'm I'm glad we're looking at the ADUs. That's great. That's a classic example of why we need to do that, but again, you're throwing this High density

2:57:46in here. And granted, not as higher far harsh powerland, but with no connection that's gonna go until it's gonna fall on us taxpayers again. And I will tell you, just like we found out earlier, uh we we heard earlier today, we don't have the infrastructure in place to make these things come in. So I don't think this one's this one's ready yet.

2:58:04I think there is um more property that is coming on the market in this area? That is um I probably can't speak to it, but there's I've heard rumors there's a big piece coming here that's also coming in. They they have every right to develop at R three, right? They're coming in at R four.

2:58:27Less than four.

2:58:27So Commissioner Starkey Less than R four. Um I I agree. You know what? Some attention needs to be made to these roads to make them safer. Um And also I I look forward to the day when we fix Hudson R Hudson. It needs to have some pedestrian safety features on it. Um and Um I have said here that I think the bus stops Especially when we're out here where there's no lighting and it's dark. Let's

2:58:58get those solar lights from Metro on here. and put 'em up there. They can't be that much and they're solar and I don't want to see kids sitting at a rural road in the dark getting on a school bus. Um I don't I don't think she we should stop doing connections because a road is substandard. I think we should keep the connections and find a way to fix the road. Because otherwise You're gonna create A gridlock traffic nightmare in the county. We

2:59:28won't have enough road to support And that that is like planning one oh one is interconnectivity. So Um I kinda agree with you that's too bad colonies Swung to the left, but We had that discussion when I think when Fairwinds was coming in. Frankly I wish we hadn't approved that at forty We should never approve 40 foot lots on that thing. Um this is sixty foot. Those houses are very nice. Uh it's it's there it's I wish we had more developments like that coming

2:59:59in the county, frankly. Um but there is some work that needs to be done here to improve uh safety. And I I was trying to find where it says Shady Hills Ranch. Was that what it's called? Shady Ranch?

3:00:15Is this Sackleson part of Shady Hills Ranches?

3:00:18My understanding is it's not.

3:00:20Okay, so there may be some deed restrictions on Sunland. Um and I don't know how that works to change that. Um So I could not find it listed here as a community. I s I saw um other neighborhoods. Paradise Acres, Florida Naturest Park, Colony Village. You find it? Right there. So okay he found it but this is this is not in in that area?

3:00:47Madam Clerk, it's just south of

3:00:49Just south

3:00:50of it. Okay.

3:00:50So when we approve the Palm Wind one, that connection there runs north-south all the way from Hudson Avenue to Fairwinds. Fairwinds goes out to Meadow Oaks, or comes over to Colleen Road. Fairly well travelled

3:01:00Is that the right-of-way?

3:01:02This one here, you'll you're letting a connection come in that doesn't connect to what's supposed to be uh vision road to go a little further. Instead you've got a very bad way to as far as connectivity goes, to make these people go in, out and or all around. And you're gonna add more traffic to the easy.

3:01:21There was property to the side of Colling Road.

3:01:24That's not their responsibility with 60 houses to build a vision road.

3:01:27Fairwinds Drive, Hudson Avenue. They made it work. Why aren't we making these guys make it work?

3:01:33And we put all that rind together. And it's a county standard road and it's a county road and it's a county maintained road. Your code tells us to connect, that's why we've connected. So to say that we haven't done something, or we did something wrong, or we didn't plan something, but

3:01:49but that's not their response.

3:01:56We are we have a large portion of Collie Road, a large r right-of-way dedication, a large obligation of what we're gonna build of Colony Road. through a configuration that you all approved through your route study, when you did palm wind, I mean we We have followed everything here and we're doing large lots Seventy t two hundred square foot lots, nice product, a good you know we have done our work and we did all of our work. What's the law? Um, this has not just been put together.

3:02:29I'm asking the county attorney for the right for what what it is that we have to follow. In approving and not approving.

3:02:39Do you have well? You've got a piece of property that is that is in your res three classification. Anything up to three units to the acre Is deemed consistent with your plan. But it doesn't have to be that maximum. They are They are at two point six seven according to this graphic. Um Which is which is which is pushing the

3:03:11side. That's actually

3:03:12Palmwind. That's

3:03:13actually what

3:03:13Palmwind

3:03:14was approved at. I'm sorry.

3:03:15No exactly.

3:03:17So so they are about ha little over half of what the

3:03:21what they're allowed to build. They're they're half of what they're allowed to build. Right.

3:03:27the maximum density for the parcel, not They it's not what they it's not of right. None of your comprehensive plan categories are of right, but you have a historic

3:03:40Um

3:03:43a historic tendency to go to almost the top of the uh of the categories, but it has to be compatible with in with the area. You've set the trend with palm wind, frankly. Um we lost it. Um and so you know

3:04:07Um

3:04:10We're taking

3:04:11way

3:04:11too long on these.

3:04:12Again, that this is the you know we

3:04:18Um So uh it I guess the the advice I'm giving i is is there a right to the the rezoning? No. But They've come in with a project that's pretty close to your comprehensive at least from standpoint of future land use. it's below the the category that they are in.

3:04:41And it builds part of the vision room. Not all of it, but part of it. Um Commissioner Oakley, Commissioner Weightman, any comments? Uh

3:04:49again, this is the third time we've talked about a vision road. Rolling through somebody's property. That's very frustrating to me. More frustrating so to the the property owner. So It's almost like setting A preeminent Yeah. Depending on how this is aligned then It's setting up the the future properties to the south potentially for what that destiny is and that property owner may not want that.

3:05:18It could sw um Commissioner Um there is a road there that that it can attach to. Doesn't have to be We don't have to build it as wide as What their um saying, right? So I and I think that I I think there's some property coming in here.

3:05:37We can't

3:05:37we

3:05:38can't speculate. We we have the facts of the day.

3:05:41But

3:05:42that's what we have the facts of the day, at least for me.

3:05:45Okay.

3:05:46And this this is what I'm basing it on. And the county has said, okay, here's where we're going to plop this road down. And it's again it's a n it's a it's another situation of a County Road. that to no fault of The projects This is they're following what the county has has laid out. And then it has a negative impact, potentially negative impact, or at least a frustrating impact. downstream to neighboring property owners. Um

3:06:16we've got to get competitive better communicating where these roads are are are potentially laid out and send folks a letter or something.

3:06:29Surprise, people get a lot of mail. Um You know. So that's another that's a piece that's frustrating here. Um

3:06:40But Commissioner Oak this wa was a route study in two thousand and two. They're the Property around here has changed hands on multiple occasions. So I'm not sure that even if we had notified everybody in the area that the alignment

3:07:01Where's the uh Is she here?

3:07:06I think she's lived in this property well before two thousand and two. Correct?

3:07:13Yes, ma'am. What year did you buy this property?

3:07:21The deed is two thousand and sixteen.

3:07:23Two thousand and sixteen.

3:07:24Well, okay.

3:07:25All right. Um listen. Uh they're not building the vision road. That's not happening Uh they're they're only going down to their entrance, so no one south That house is not affected with this project right here. So um

3:07:48Madam Chairman

3:07:49M.

3:07:49If you look to where that Condolane Road intersects and and and ends on this property. If it blows it up on the screen, you could actually see it goes designed to go right through her house.

3:08:01I that is that is that is a conceptual route, not an actual route. Well

3:08:07look

3:08:07so you have to look at that.

3:08:09I am. I'm looking at Paul and right beside it. You tell me where where else that road's gonna go. go? You've got no other options right now, but

3:08:14I'm going to go on the road that's there existing.

3:08:17There's no there's no road existing right now.

3:08:19I'm looking at it it right there, right?

3:08:21It ends at Foxfire.

3:08:22We're up here. It's down

3:08:24and and because our staff, no one this visual road was there didn't allow for that road to come in. We could have been moved around then and at that time. So instead all we did is have them stub in to connect.

3:08:34Can it go more to the east?

3:08:38Now that's gonna take a conversation with Palm Wynn because you got that little green spot right there. If you could get that, if you could get land to the side of the developments to the side, that's that there's a narrow piece and it extends out a little bit further, it would connect to Colony Road to go forward.

3:08:51So

3:08:51that I don't think that di discussion's been had and frankly. Now that we can see what we got to deal with? I mean, do you really want to tell Ms. Erickson we're gonna be taking her property one of these days?

3:09:01Um

3:09:05County engineer, can you talk about the Vision Road, please? Sorry.

3:09:14Do you want me to redraw the line on the fly or do you want to be re looking at it further?

3:09:21That is conceptual. Is that correct? The exact route.

3:09:26Well But so a

3:09:27route study.

3:09:28It said that there was a route study, so it's less than conceptual. Okay, so

3:09:32it's

3:09:32more than that. Could we revisit the assumptions that were made in the route study? Certainly. Okay. Does that put this application in a state of wait and see? Unfortunately it would. Because the footprint on their property may also be affected.

3:09:48And this and we did the route study in 2002. And this property was purchased in twenty sixteen? Is that what you said?

3:09:56The the Erickson property, the deed deed out was in twenty sixteen. I

3:10:02And you approve palm wind? With no vision vote on their property in twenty twenty three.

3:10:09That connects all the way to fair ones.

3:10:13I'm sorry, Barbara, what'd you say? I said you approved. Palm one and twenty June of twenty twenty three, less than two years ago Which cemented this alignment in place because you didn't put it on their property. So you

3:10:32All right. Um you know, we we gotta move one way or another. We've gotta do something. So I'm looking to my board for what you wanna do here. We can't just stand here and look at each other all day.

3:10:43And I can tell you that I mean we our whole s southeastern corner is going to you guys, so I mean

3:10:50Is it Madam Chair? I I'm not sure what the board wants to do with this, but I did craft a condition to deal with the cross section issue. To make it clear that we're not approving that cross section with the MPD approval and it'll be approved. Had site plan approval. I sent this condition to Barbara and the county engineer. I realize she probably hasn't seen it, but Um I did draft an amendment to condition twenty three to address that issue if you were inclined to approve this.

3:11:15And I think that's a good compromise. We go back to, you know, a thirty three foot road for now. This isn't the Hundred foot boulevard, whatever that's hundred across the road.

3:11:27They're still gonna be required to give one hundred and twenty four feet of right-way.

3:11:30Okay.

3:11:30What I'm saying is that the design of what it goes in that right of way would be deferred to site plan approval and through the county engineer to review that cross section. So that you're not approving the cross section that was shown

3:11:43earlier. That only addresses your concern about bike lanes and multi parts paths. It doesn't.

3:11:51It does take the width. You can decide on a width.

3:11:55It doesn't change the alignment.

3:11:57It does within that boundary, right? It doesn't change what what right away we're giving, right? But yes, that's true.

3:12:06Right. Because you had concerns with the way that was designed, so that's what I tried to draft with that condition. But that only deals with that one issue. I just wanted to make sure that if you approved it, you've made that change. That's all I'm asking.

3:12:19But if you're not sure if you're From what I was hearing just from the county engineer, if we wait a little bit and discuss this vision road, it might affect that project, right?

3:12:30You can see that Palmlands is all the way to our property line. They have homes there. So this alignment. was decided when you approved a route study and then you approved palmlands. There you can see those site plan. That's an approved site plan. Right. It's hard for me because I There are homes there are homes there. Right. So home on that they have the right to do it.

3:12:54We have a bailiff

3:12:54and I'm gonna tell you again, this

3:12:55is my last time you cannot talk about

3:12:56it.

3:12:57I didn't do Pomwinds. I I mean we this property. This is your alignment of division road. And it's not like i we could say, Oh, palmlands isn't developed yet, let's put it over on Palmlands or on their property. We approved palm winds. And this is the alignment.

3:13:16Barbara, your your property line is that dark dark black line going north south? Is that uh is that big green blob a wetland? Is that what's going on there? I mean can you take palm wind straight up? I mean colonies straight up.

3:13:29There's a wetland there.

3:13:34Yeah.

3:13:35The pinch point

3:13:36is that corner.

3:13:36Yeah, that's the south that you're so but we're giving I mean look at our property and our right of way. Our right of way is the southeast corner. So That's So where it comes down to property that we don't own and the county doesn't own is our southeast corner.

3:13:55So that's

3:13:59We we we're either approving or denying or we're continuing.

3:14:04Palm wind palm wind project. That we've had to donate extra right away so you can have connectivity between the Vision Road and Palm Wind. Can you go to Pasco Mac for

3:14:17Can you

3:14:17pull up Haskell

3:14:18mapper?

3:14:25So this road Okay, can you go to Pasco Mapper for me up there? And then and um this road was this alignment was done in two thousand and two. Is that what you're saying? Could you please go to that corner of Fox Fire and Colony? And show me what it looked like in two thousand and two. Say two thousand and three.

3:14:49And maybe that's

3:14:50Yeah, I would I would say it was approved in two thousand and two and then reinforced in June of twenty twenty three when you when you approved Palmwind.

3:15:05Madam Chair? Yeah. So I'm gonna I'm gonna say this Hudson Avenue is a two lane road. We don't have even sidewalks out there all the way through, right? We're working on putting those things together though. has got a plan to do that. And we've done some other developments down the road. So I don't know why I need a Full lane row with all the bells and whistles you got on here. Well probably a two-lane road would help control the density better. I mean all the way down. So I mean that redo Colony Road all the way down. Probably at the intersections Uh

3:15:35more turn lanes, whatever, but

3:15:38What I would say is that you know that's a solution for today is even if we just Uh we reserve the right of way, but plan on for now. a two lane, much narrower road, much less Affecting Um her and then one day maybe she wants to sell. Um or something. Things happen. And and if it's needed, we could widen the road then. We don't have I'm s I am sure that that road's not gonna be four lanes any time. in the near

3:16:08future. I mean Trinity Boulevard isn't even four lanes yet.

3:16:13So

3:16:15Madam Chair, can I clarify something? And I Barbara has said this. They are not building the road south of their

3:16:25first connection to it. So What the county does within that hundred twenty-four feet of right-of-way south of that and how many lanes we build and what alignment we pick is totally up to us. So we're not setting that today. The only and they're only building two lanes to their entrance. So this approval does not obligate us to build four lanes south of that, but it doesn't obligate us to build in any particular alignment south of that. But it probably does need to connect to existing colony

3:16:55road.

3:16:58Um looking at this map here, um

3:17:01What year is this? Two thousand one? Well this was before the road went on the map. Can we see it on two thousand and three or whatever how you do it? Four and can we go to two thousand six?

3:17:18Okay, can we keep going?

3:17:24Okay.

3:17:25Madam Chair, if I may. David Allen. As it is you know, we're we're getting late in in the on this particular item and and and I've I've been taking notes here and I I think we've nailed it down to three key three major issues. One is the cross section of the road, which I think is a technical issue that Mr. Goldstein had mentioned previously and I think we can work through that and come up with um an alternative um section that would meet um the

3:17:56needs that we've talked about today um and fit that within the right-way. That's number one. Number two I think though from what I'm hearing on the vision road is the specific alignment that we're looking at and the challenge that we have quite frankly right now is that we are Really hyper focused on this corner piece of property. When you look at the whole of Colony Road all the way down to where it's supposed to connect. There is going to have to be a lot of additional property acquisitions, right-of-acquisitions, or any other things like that. So I think that this is a good opportunity

3:18:26for us as staff to take a look at that and reevaluate that vision road piece. And then thirdly, um one of the things I heard particularly from the community was the concerns with cut-through traffic on this project and Um certainly the project proponent has uh met the code requirements, but I think it was Commissioner Mariano who suggested maybe we have a cul-de-sac at the end of that one piece and really force all of the traffic.

3:18:55Can I suggest that instead of a cotton sec we put an emergency exit and so that one day if when Fox fire gets fixed, people who are trying to get home here don't have to go all the way up and around if there's a perfectly fine road. Oh, y you're stressing you're stressing areas to the north maybe when you don't need to, but wait until Fox Fire is improved.

3:19:17And and I think the the point I was gonna make was that really would require a board action because it's a it's a change from the land development code.

3:19:24I I would agree. That's why I It's not emergency access only because it is a code requirement, it's ultimately your decision. Do you want it to be a full access per the code? Do you want it to be emergency access only? Your decision. That's what I told Planning Commission, that's why they didn't take any action on it, because they're just they're following your code, but it's ultimately your decision.

3:19:48I I'm good with that.

3:19:52Nope. Sorry.

3:19:58Commissioner Mariano, it's your district. We've got to do that.

3:20:03I'm going to continue it.

3:20:11Second.

3:20:14How's the applicable? If you're gonna continue it, you need a date certain.

3:20:20Don't do it on don't do it on the t on How

3:20:23much time would we need to re-look at this? Yeah.

3:20:28Don't be sure.

3:20:33I know. I know. So I could I ask, we're agreeable to emergency access, I just said that onto Foxfire. It's your decision, and if that's what you want to do. What else can my my what else and we've agreed to a condition that Whether you want us to do a two-lane cross-section, a four-lane cross-section, bike lanes, no bike lanes, you can set it.

3:20:57W what else are you going to do to my project? The client needs to move forward. We've been working on this for a while with all of you. Uh I am

3:21:08comfortable with that.

3:21:09And and so in our our density is lower than palm wind, so You've already set what's compatible. We're accommodating your vision road. You've heard that we're going to give right of way, and if you don't want all of it and you want to use all of it, more green space. So I just don't know what a continuance and maybe you can tell me what a continuance other than hurting this project and hurting this these the the folks developing this project. Um which by the way you look at everybody looks at their renders and says this is a quality

3:21:39project. These are gonna be expensive homes. These are not our lower end product, these are expensive homes. Which will be an actual benefit. to property values. I know that's always debatable. But I I just don't know what other than hurting this project, what we would accomplish Different.

3:21:57My my my showing deference to the district commissioner My concern isn't necessarily to the density, it's to the alignment of the roadway.

3:22:05That's got nothing to do with their project.

3:22:07It has su it has well it they're building the

3:22:09first leg.

3:22:10They built the first leg's coming down between them and the county.

3:22:13That's the only place they can go.

3:22:14And it's setting precedent, of course, the project to the east. And when when this gets built, it's setting precedent to the south. And

3:22:26With the third time we've talked about this today, there's a bigger conversation that needs to be had, I think, between each commissioner and staff. Unfortunately your project is potentially hemmed up with a a thirty day conversation. But for me it's not necessarily about the density, it's about the roadway traveling south. in showing deference to Commissioner Oakley. Who seemingly has Some more questions that aren't that aren't answered. If he wants to change his motion. Happy to support. Which way he wants to go? But

3:22:56again with staff I'd like to have

3:23:01spokes with you all about these vision roads and kind of a better way to go about or at least giving a um You know the public a better idea of what's what's going on because again this is a third time Today in the conversation.

3:23:19So March twenty fifth is your next meeting in New Port Richey.

3:23:24And you don't have a whole board.

3:23:26And you don't have a full board ninth in Dade City if you're willing to go there or the twenty second in Newport Ritchie of April.

3:23:36What would the applicant prefer, March twenty-fifth or april twenty second?

3:23:40Or

3:23:40Dade City. Both of those may kill the project, so maybe everybody will be happy about that. But that's what I'm hearing whisper my ear that they're getting to the point of their contract that it'll might kill it. So

3:23:53We have done it can't tell you how frustrating this is because we have done everything right. I'm sorry.

3:24:00way less density than what you did in Pullm Wynn. Something respectable, something good, and accommodating your vision road that you all set And you set it with Palm Wind in June of 2023, you made the decision where this alignment was going to go, you reinforced it, and to tell these folks. And I don't see what that solution is. I really you know, I'm I Doing this a long time and I can see like okay in thirty days we're gonna There's not This is The alignment.

3:24:32You and you have a lot of properties on Colony Road. But I think what you've been told is What we'll do is work on the width. Right, so that you'll get all of our right of way and we'll work with you on the with, that is the where you can continue to plan As opposed to just saying I don't even know what the conversation is because you have a route study, you have palm wind, we're setting the the the width of the right-of-way. If you want us to build a two-lane, and then that'll be your present, you've got that ability to do that, to

3:25:02tell us what to build within that wide right-of-way. And that's where I would ask you to please move this project along and let that be the discussion. Because you and you all can talk about that. We got time before plans are approved, you all can talk about that and then the board can give the county engineer instructions saying, I want to see this road built in that hundred and twenty-four feet. But please don't stop us at this point. for your decision on what you want built within a hundred and twenty four feet because we're gonna give you the right of way We've done everything right and

3:25:32you all can just talk at your next meeting or the next meeting after that, what do you want us to build that 124 feet and you can look at how you want things to be down the line and you can give that direction with the condition that Mr. Goldstein has drafted to add to this.

3:25:48Madam Chair, I think we could probably get this road down as low as as we saw earlier today, as even l as low as thirty-three feet, except for the intersections up there. Uh right now we're paying mob in mobility fee credits with some of the roadway that's in there right now, which is not a good economic move 'cause we need all the road built and we're gonna have to pay for that connection as well. So economically it's not a good move for us. I will tell you I was disappointed with staff before with calling the road not connecting up through there. The connections that the other development has coming from fairway, it makes a good connection where they

3:26:18got two ways to get out to the south. This here is one way and people are gonna go travel down Fox fire, up and over, come back in. Um it just the road's not set for it. We need to go look at what we really can do. And there's a piece of property on the side of Colony Road. If you saw it as like one thin little sliver down, then another thing over. It's unused right now from the development side. On the east side. On the east side that we have to do.

3:26:43I think there's

3:26:44I think you've got to find opportunity on the

3:26:45east side.

3:26:46So let's go take thirty days and see if we can make it happen. So I'll move to continue March twenty fifth.

3:26:53Um I I'm gonna suggest that you go to Dade City on April ninth. I do not want to go where the people

3:26:59can't go.

3:27:02So

3:27:02Okay. Well I'm not

3:27:03here

3:27:03March twenty fifth so

3:27:05I I don't want to continue at all. I'd I'd rather have two weeks to the next day city, but y I mean you it's ultimately your decision. But

3:27:15Nothing anything done in two weeks.

3:27:17Yeah. It's just a matter of the road, um Is that is that a park in Palm Wind, that green space? Just kinda curious what that is.

3:27:31It looks like it's a p a park and not a um I think I think there's opportunity to swing this road to the to the East. I also say you don't have to build that road right now. People's lives change, things come on the market, opportunities happen. Who was saying Chair?

3:27:47Oh right here. Just to answer the question, the green space in the Palm Winds Plan would be a neighborhood park.

3:27:53Okay.

3:27:55Can we do two weeks? I'm fine with that. Hopefully I can hold my stuff together for a project.

3:28:02Can you try in two weeks?

3:28:04For your off site condition.

3:28:07Uh you you have two that are okay. You guys are okay

3:28:10for two weeks? And do you want to close your public hearing? Mr. Goldstein do you want an option for that, Mr. Steinschneider? Close your public hearing two weeks. Fa staff can bring you more facts, we can talk more, drill down on on the Mm. How this all fits. Can I

3:28:28take a motion? Can I get a motion?

3:28:30Yeah.

3:28:32Yeah. Oh we have one?

3:28:34Two I mean two weeks. Part of the reason we're in this trouble, frankly, is the p I don't know if the public were noticed about it, but I didn't hear anything about this um until just coming forward. I don't know if you guys did public hearing or not, but I'm not sure if you're public meetings with the people but it's clearly There's a lot of new stuff that's coming out that Um The residents are speaking pretty loud. So I I I really want to have it right here where the people can come.

3:29:00So you're gonna re you're gonna redo the public hearing?

3:29:06No, I think he's saying he I are you gonna Are you good with cl well the board can always o reopen the public comment but

3:29:14I don't think we should be closing the public hearing because now we're gonna come back with new information. I think the people should be able to hear it.

3:29:19But you already have closed the public hearing. You've allowed applicant rebuttal. You can reopen it for the limited purpose of the changes if you wish to. I'd like that's what I'd like to do. Um But what I heard you what I heard you saying is you wanted it in Newport Ritchie. Yes.

3:29:39That's where it should be.

3:29:43Okay, that's a month then, or more than a month.

3:29:47It's um sounds like it's a month, right? It's three what was the date?

3:29:51March twenty fifth.

3:29:53It's a month.

3:29:55Any emotion?

3:29:57We have the motion. Could you just clarify it when we motion to continue March 25th when we will reopen the public hearing on the things that change in the project?

3:30:06I'll second it. 130 or soon thereafter. All in favor? Aye.

3:30:10Aye. Reluctantly. All right. We are on the Madam Chair, just one last question.

3:30:15Yeah.

3:30:16Is is the board okay with the emergency access to Fox Fire? Because we need to draft the condition.

3:30:20I am. Mm.

3:30:22So it sounds like that's consent. Okay.

3:30:27Okay.